[?]are scanlines important for you?

Don't care (cuz I only have CRT TV's :icon_bigg )

 

scanlines for president!

 

Huh? This is a terrible idea. Sprites from a 2D game that are made w/ a 480 (i or p, doesn't matter) display in mind should not be displayed in 240p. I've seen Arcana Heart 2 running in 240p at Shibuya Kaikan (right next to it running in 480p) and the 240p one looks like shit. You're missing half the screen.

The issue is that HDTV's don't have scanlines at all... none that aren't simulated by hardware (XRGB2) or software (emulators, settings such as the late Sega Ages 2500 series). A true scanline is an artifact... one that 31khz displays do away with.

If we're talking about bitmapped based games, upscaled *anything* is crap. Composite, Component, or anything.

I searched high and low when I lived in Hawaii. There are two viable options for buying an RGB CRT in North America of size 20" or larger:
-Sony PVM
-Arcade monitor route as I suggested on page 1

The quality of the latter is far greater than the PVM in almost every case.

 

Listen, I didn't say 480i games should be scaled to 240p, nothing close to that. I said some (many aliased games) should be displayed interlaced rather than progressive, alternating "scanlines" each field of the frame to prevent "emulator syndrome", as you would obviously agree.

You're confusing HDTV with fixed pixel displays which most of them happen to be. 31 kHz displays are no different than 15 kHz displays, they just have a different horizontal frequency requirement. If you take a 240p game, and you duplicate frames so the game runs at 120hz, your horizontal frequency will meet the 31 kHz requirement, and they will display 240p with "TRUE" scanlines. 480p and every other mode have "scanlines" of sorts too, the space between lines, you just don't notice them as they get smaller and smaller--use a magnifying glass or adjust the V height 200% if possible to see.

Come on now, quit with the zealotry, "the PVM"? Which PVM? PVMs most gamers are able to buy are 15-25 years old and dilapidated from being 24 hour workhorses. It's not exactly fair to compare those to a new privately owned arcade monitor, at least compare them to an arcade monitor of comparable age and history. I don't think your findings will be as you just concluded.

 

I use a Sony PVM RGB monitor. That tells you my answer. I love my RGB monitor. =) I use it for classic systems (SFC, Saturn, NES, Etc.) and JAMMA Arcade games.

 

Are CRT tv's with component input easier to find in the US? There are devices that let you transcode RGB scart to component. Just buy yourself a scart multi select box, an RGB scart to component transcoder, and you can hook up a lot of classic systems.

I never exactly knew what was meant with scanlines until I started playing games in 60Hz mode (I'm from Europe) on my TV. Most classic consoles just slap black borders in the picture and squeeze the image for PAL output, so there are not much of scanlines to see then.

 

Yes, but AFAIK even these are hard to find these days. Everything's shifting to HD. You could probably pick one up used for next to nothing.

 

The TV in my front room is a JVC iART or something. It's a flat CRT with component but no progressive. It's really got nice color. Rocks for old games but I don't want to lug everything in there.

 

I agree, as most SDTVs are cheap and often don't feature much if even up to S-Video. But for awhile you could find SDTVs that had Component Video but were still 480i. Dunno about the quality of all of them compared to a professional RGB monitor though. Really I've only ever seen one SDTV that had Component.

 

My Wega CRT (which had AV Multi which is RGB) also had a D-Video connector in the back. Pretty sure it was up to 480i only.

 

my WEGA CRT has progressive scan and RGB it also has something called DRC-MF which I think forces any signal to progressive scan mode (Correct me if m i wrong here)

 

Scanlines are gay.

 

If I didn't vote I'm an idiot, I'd probably say not really.

 

Are these badboys any good for old school RGB goodness:

Sony PVM-2950
sony gvm-2000

????? ????

 

and... NEC pm-197A... this d00d wants $29 for it.

 

I can't say for sure, but any Sony PVM should give a nice picture. But not all have RGB input by default. The most common ways it would connect RGB would be a 25 Pin D-Sub connector (like your PC parallel port) or BNC connectors for Red,Green,Blue, and Sync. Check for those. The BNC is likely labeled RGB, and the 25 pin connecter will say like CMPTR for Computer.

 

Do all Sony PVM's have RGB?

 

do all/any PVMs support progressive scan up to EDTV? What is their maximum resolution and refresh rate? how many inches do they come in? Do they have a remote control?

 

Nearly all PVM are 15 kHz H, 50-60 Hz V, interlaced only. Possibly the only ones with 480p are high definition models which generally cost over $1000 used, it's not easy to find a catalog of the various models... Some have IR remote controls, older ones only have wired remote controls and probably the really old ones have none. PVMs have 10+ MHz RGB bandwidth so that's great H resolution. Sizes are generally 14", 20", 25", 32".

 

Thanks for the informative post Calpis, now you're in trouble for I ll PM you moaning about some weird computer-related error and seeking some hardware opinion.