Early Saturn Game Screen shots

Yakumo · Jun 1, 2009

saturn_worship said:

yakumo do you have more early panzer shots?
Click to expand...

yes, somewhere. I'll get them scanned in the future.

Barc0de · Jun 1, 2009

any hi-resolution PDS:Azel art for Barc0de's desktop? =) 1650x1080 would be perfect if anyone has already done any adjustments/photoshop.

rod_wod · Jun 10, 2009

better pic

Druidic teacher · Jun 22, 2017

x

Yakumo · Jun 11, 2009

Druid II said:

huh, which one?
Click to expand...

The Video CD one. It's called, Saturn CG Collection. Put the disc in to your PC to find some stills.

Yakumo

GigaDrive · Jul 2, 2009

7Force said:

I have the Japanese Circuit Edition, and like you said, the handling is much better but still doesn't feel like Daytona.

When you look at the pretty much arcade perfect Sega Rally port you can't help but think what the Saturn could have really done with Daytona.
Click to expand...

When you say pretty much arcade perfect Sega Rally port, you're talking about gameplay, right? Because, although the graphics are really good for Saturn, and much better than the first Saturn Daytona, Sega Rally is still nowhere near the Model 2 arcade graphics.

*half the framerate: 30fps instead of 60fps
*much lower graphic complexity/detail (fewer polygons)
*lower quality texture-mapping
*lower resolution

Daytona Championchip Circuit Edition and Circuit Edition use a modified Saturn Sega Rally engine.

GigaDrive · Jul 2, 2009

Somewhat off-topic:

Can you people imagine how utterly mind-blowing the Saturn would've been, if it used Lockheed Martin's Real3D/100 chipset?

Imagine a "Super Saturn" with 12 or 16MB total RAM -- Divided between the CPU and graphics, a PowerPC 603e CPU, and the Real3D/100 which is a geometry processor, pixel processor and texture processor, but all on one chip. For 2D, a combined VDP1+VDP2 single chip.

Give it a 4x or 6x speed CD-ROM. Keep the Saturn's audio subsystem as it was very good.

So the twin Hitachi SH-2 CPU and other not-needed processors, are gone.

1.) PowerPC 603e for CPU
2.) Real3D/100 GPU for 3D
3.) VDP1+2 for 2D
4.) SCSP for audio

It's somewhat more powerful than the following machines
*Sega/Martin Marietta Model 2 arcade board
*Nintendo 64
*3DFX Voodoo Graphics
*3DO M2

It's around 30-40% of the Model 3 arcade board, and used in arcades to replace the Model 2 (unlike the ST-V board) since it's better in everyway.

Let your imaginations be filled with this as an example of the visuals

accel99 · Jul 2, 2009

GigaDrive said:

Somewhat off-topic:

Can you people imagine how utterly mind-blowing the Saturn would've been, if it used Lockheed Martin's Real3D/100 chipset?

Imagine a "Super Saturn" with 12 or 16MB total RAM -- Divided between the CPU and graphics, a PowerPC 603e CPU, and the Real3D/100 which is a geometry processor, pixel processor and texture processor, but all on one chip. For 2D, a combined VDP1+VDP2 single chip.

Give it a 4x or 6x speed CD-ROM. Keep the Saturn's audio subsystem as it was very good.

So the twin Hitachi SH-2 CPU and other not-needed processors, are gone.

1.) PowerPC 603e for CPU
2.) Real3D/100 GPU for 3D
3.) VDP1+2 for 2D
4.) SCSP for audio

It's somewhat more powerful than the following machines
*Sega/Martin Marietta Model 2 arcade board
*Nintendo 64
*3DFX Voodoo Graphics
*3DO M2

It's around 30-40% of the Model 3 arcade board, and used in arcades to replace the Model 2 (unlike the ST-V board) since it's better in everyway.

Let your imaginations be filled with this as an example of the visuals
Click to expand...

Thats like me thinking about how sega should have held out a little longer and made the dreamcast have naomi 2 like hardware.Wild Riders anyone?

Segafreak_NL · Jul 2, 2009

:nod:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PCgnLlSIJY

7Force · Jul 2, 2009

GigaDrive said:

When you say pretty much arcade perfect Sega Rally port, you're talking about gameplay, right? Because, although the graphics are really good for Saturn, and much better than the first Saturn Daytona, Sega Rally is still nowhere near the Model 2 arcade graphics.

*half the framerate: 30fps instead of 60fps
*much lower graphic complexity/detail (fewer polygons)
*lower quality texture-mapping
*lower resolution

Daytona Championchip Circuit Edition and Circuit Edition use a modified Saturn Sega Rally engine.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I know "almost arcade perfect" was an exaggeration, but it's just about as close as you can get on the Saturn, which proves Daytona could've been so much better.

GigaDrive said:

Somewhat off-topic:

Can you people imagine how utterly mind-blowing the Saturn would've been, if it used Lockheed Martin's Real3D/100 chipset?

Imagine a "Super Saturn" with 12 or 16MB total RAM -- Divided between the CPU and graphics, a PowerPC 603e CPU, and the Real3D/100 which is a geometry processor, pixel processor and texture processor, but all on one chip. For 2D, a combined VDP1+VDP2 single chip.

Give it a 4x or 6x speed CD-ROM. Keep the Saturn's audio subsystem as it was very good.

So the twin Hitachi SH-2 CPU and other not-needed processors, are gone.

1.) PowerPC 603e for CPU
2.) Real3D/100 GPU for 3D
3.) VDP1+2 for 2D
4.) SCSP for audio

It's somewhat more powerful than the following machines
*Sega/Martin Marietta Model 2 arcade board
*Nintendo 64
*3DFX Voodoo Graphics
*3DO M2

It's around 30-40% of the Model 3 arcade board, and used in arcades to replace the Model 2 (unlike the ST-V board) since it's better in everyway.
Click to expand...

That would've also been ridiculously expensive in 1995. Even the regular Saturn was kinda bordering on "too expensive" after the infamous Sony announcement where the Playstation's price was dropped $100.

GigaDrive · Jul 3, 2009

I agree it would be much too expensive in 1995. but late 1996?
it could've put out of $399, due to:
*chip integration (VDP1+VDP2 in one chip,
Real3D geometry+pixel+texture in one chip, both lowering costs)
*chip shrinkage (50 micron down to 35 micron)
*only having 1 CPU instead of 2 (like Saturn and M2)
*falling memory prices
(remember that's what allowed 3DFX Voodoo1 to be sold for $299 in late 1996)

We're not talking about a generation beyond N64 and M2 or anything, just something that's slightly better than M2.

In a similar way that Matsushita and Sega almost struck a deal over M2, it could've been concievable that Sega and Matsushita could strike a deal over this powerful incarnation of Saturn. If Sega could get Matsushita and Hitachi to mass produce these consoles, it would lower costs further. Matsushita+SEGA together could've beaten back Sony.

By 1997, after a year on the market, the price could be lowered to $299.

Developers would've fully embraced such a system IMO.

Also, if someone mentioned everything that was going into the actually-released Saturn of 1994,1995 but back in 1992-1993, everyone would say it would've cost *more* than the $700 3DO. Afterall, the Saturn was far more powerful than 3DO. And while Saturn wasn't cheap, like N64's $199 or PS1's $299, it still sold for much less than 3DO's launch price. If we remove the mess of Saturn's architecture, fill it with quality custom+off the shelf components, launch it 1.5 to 2 years later in late 1996 (alongside N64, and thus giving Genesis+SegaCD more time in the U.S.) I think a system close to what I'm describing could've been possible.

There was a faction of Sega of Japan's own management that wanted to due something along the lines of this:

Dreamcast is a system born out of Sega's darkest hour, a do-or-die
machine which will decide whether the company stays in the hardware
business. Its precursor, the 32bit Sega Saturn, had been widely
expected to conquer the world with Nintendo's own second next
generation system heavily delayed -- due to the collapse of an
alliance with Sony -- and neither Atari nor 3DO seriously threatening
mass market success.
All that changed with the November '93 announcement of the Sony
PlayStation, a system which would heavily defeat Sega's system and
become a considerable influence on how Sega designed Dreamcast.
Although there had been rumours of Sony producing a console, what came
as a heavy shock to Sega was the technical superiority of the
PlayStation. While the Saturn had been designed as perhaps the
ultimate 2D arcade machine, albeit with a substantial 3D capability,
PlayStation was totally committed to polygons.

Sega boss Hayao Nakayama angrily berated Sega's engineers for their
failings, but it was too late to totally redesign the system if the
1994 launch was too proceed. Instead, Sega added yet another processor
to an already over-complicated design. In terms of raw power, the new
Saturn was much more of a match for PlayStation, but it would never be
an easy machine to program for. The twin CPU design in particular
demanded highly specialised machine code rather than the C most
Japanese developers prefered: barely a year after Saturn's launch a
key Sega manager admitted only one in a hundred programmers would have
the skill to use the machine's full potential.

Ironically, the Saturn's Japanese launch would be Sega's best ever
performance in its home territory. Even a flawed version of Virtua
Fighting was enough to transform the company's traditional weakness in
its home territory. Overseas, however, it was to be a different
matter. Scepticism about the prospects of a CD-ROM machine succeeding
in the cost-sensitive US market meant Saturn was originally partnered
with a low-cost, cart-based system codenamed Jupiter -- principally
due to American scepticism that a CD-ROM machine could be
competitively priced. When Saturn was upgraded, Jupiter got axed in
favour of Mars, an upgrade for Sega's 16bit Mega Drive which was
supposed to protect the company's hugely lucrative US market. In fact,
32X was an unmitigated disaster, drawing vital developer support away
from Saturn and destroying the company's reputation among gamers who
found themselves with an add-on with barely a handful of games.

The Saturn debacle would cost the jobs of Sega's American and Japanese
bosses, beside reducing its US empire to a ruin running up losses of
$167 million in 1997. For any replacement machine the lessons were
clear: a single format, complete user-friendliness for developers and
a new brand -- so low had sunk the once mighty Sega name.

As soon as any console is launched, work is usually underway on a replacement but the Saturn's troubles gave this process an unusual urgency for Sega. By 1995, rumours surfaced that US defence contractors Lockheed Martin Corp. were already deep into the development of a replacement, possibly even with a view to releasing it as a Saturn upgrade. There were even claims that during Saturn's pre-launch panic a group of managers argued the machine should simply be scrapped in favour of an all-new LMC design.

Sega originally entered into partnership with LMC to solve problems
with its Model 2 coin-op board, however by 1995 the relationship had
soured somewhat with the Model 3 board suffering massive delays.
Around the same time, 3DO began shopping around its 64bit M2 system.
According to informed sources, Sega's Japanese bankers had brokered an
unwritten deal whereby Matsushita would manufacture M2 units, while
Sega would concentrate on the software. M2 devkits were supplied to
Sega in early 1996, with initial work reputedly concentrating on a
Virtua Fighter 3 conversion for M2's launch.

Sega's M2 project soon fell apart however. 3DO's Trip Hawkins blamed
corporate ‘egos' for the collapse, while Sega insisted its engineers
were unconvinced M2 was the breakthrough technology they needed.
Instead, the company was increasingly preoccupied by the PC market --
unlike Nintendo, it was fully prepared to convert its games onto the
format and in mid-1995 it had entered into a partnership with PC
graphics card manufacturer nVidia. Under the terms of the deal, Sega
would supply ports of key Saturn titles exclusively for the nVidia PC
graphics card. At the time, pundits wondered if Sega might be
switching from Saturn to nVidia as its principal platform.

By 1996, this speculation was ebbing away as two clear frontrunners
emerged in the PC graphics market: VideoLogic's PowerVR and 3Dfx's
Voodoo chipsets. Sega approached both companies to be partners in two
parallel Saturn 2 projects, each of which having minimal if any
knowledge of the other. The 3Dfx-Sega of America project was codenamed
Black Belt, while the VideoLogic-Sega of Japan system was known as
Dural. Although console development is usually shrouded in total
secrecy, Saturn 2's development coincided with the rise of the
Internet and Black Belt soon became a popular topic of gossip. For a
time, many presumed Black Belt was the only new Sega system.

All this changed on July 22nd, 1997, when 3Dfx was informed them Black
Belt was cancelled. It was a shattering blow -- "Our contract with
Sega was considered to be gospel right up until we received the call,"
admitted marketing manager Chris Kramer. Two months later, 3Dfx issued
a lawsuit against Sega while blaming VideoLogic's Japanese backers,
NEC, for bringing influence to bear on a decision which would
otherwise have gone to 3Dfx. An initial burst of publicity soon gave
way to highly confidential discussions which settled the lawsuit away
from the public eye in August 1998.

For outsiders, 3Dfx had always been the favoured partner due to their
leadership in the PC market, moreover Sega let it be known the
decision to cancel wasn't due to either performance or cost reasons.
What may have been a factor is 3Dfx's very strength made it a
difficult partner for Sega, VideoLogic's second-place status obviously
made it the hungrier partner. Moreover, whereas 3Dfx see themselves as
creating a new gaming platform around their Voodoo hardware and Glide
software, VideoLogic were much more eager to use Microsoft's Direct3D
API.

Whatever the reasoning behind the decision, the PowerVR decision
further dampened excitement about a machine soon to be redubbed
Katana. In January '98, UK trade newspaper CTW ran a savage onslaught
upon the new format: "When one looks at a format owner that actually
struggles to garner interest in its latest hardware announcements, you
know it''s in trouble. From Black Belt to Dural and Katana,
journalists have leapt into headline mode, but the level of
disinterest elsewhere is palpable." Commenting upon the latest
redundancies in America and Britain, Dinsey wondered whether the
company was "giving up and trying to re-invent itself as a PC
publisher."

In May, Sega gave its response with the official announcement of its
new system, its specifications and that controversial name: Dreamcast.
The marketing campaign began with the announcement of the marketing
campaign and its $100 million budget for each territory: America,
Europe and Japan. Sega boss Shoichiro Irimajiri put the cost of
hardware development at $50-80 million, software development at
$150-200 million, which with marketing added up to half a billion
dollars.

The PR statements were suitably bullish: "Dreamcast is Sega's bridge
to world-wide market leadership for the 21st century" commented Sega
US VP Bernie Stolar. "I am confident that Dreamcast will become a de
facto standard for digital entertainment" claimed Sega chairman Isso
Okawa. However, it was at E3 itself that the tide really began to turn
for Sega with bravura software demos finally earning the machine
journalists' respect. Post E3 reports were full of adoration , as
impressed by the restoration of Sega's old self-confidence as the raw
processing power on show. Dreamcast's launch date was set as November
20th and this time all Sony can threaten is the announcement of new
hardware -- 1998 is Dreamcast's alone.

From E3 onwards, Sega orchestrated a careful drumbeat of
announcements, including the launch of the VMS unit on July 11th to
tie-in with the Godzilla movie and a much hyped August 22nd PR event
for Sega's old mascot in Sonic Adventure. In September, Sega ran an ad
showing MD Eiichi Yukawa being abused by members of the public who
preferred Sony -- and promising all would change with Dreamcast's
arrival. And so it is, everything now rests with the machine and its
software.
Click to expand...

Taucias · Jul 3, 2009

$400 would have been too expensive still. It is, even now.

Druidic teacher · Jun 22, 2017

x

Taucias · Jul 8, 2009

And keep it cool.

rod_wod · Jul 27, 2009

More pics

Hi here are some more saturn pics for you to enjoy.

virtua fighter 2 proto

shinobi

Dark Saviour proto (maybe)

Faradoon (unreleased maybe) we may know this by another name now

Yakumo · Jul 27, 2009

Nice fine! Always nice to see more beta Shin Shinobi shots! The ones in pink are from the final games but those below are from the early build. I'd love to see that in motion. It just looks so much better than what was released in design at least.

Never heard of Faradoon either so that's another to add to the unreleased list.

I really need to get scanning some of the other stuff I have for you guys and gals.

Yakumo

rod_wod · Jul 27, 2009

Cool cheers i thought some of the shinobi pics may be the final copy of the game but i was not sure i also would love to play the beta too.
i can't wait to see your scans man :nod:

Juste · Jul 27, 2009

I think title of Faradoon (Faradoon: The Legend of Dragon Castle) changed to Monica no Shiro.

rod_wod · Jul 28, 2009

You could be correct i found this
http://midikey.egloos.com/3380810

rod_wod · Jul 29, 2009

team sonic

Oh the saturn sonic saga the game that never was.

pics are form sonic fighters arcade witch was also planned for the saturn at one point i think.

Early Saturn Game Screen shots

Yakumo Pillar of the Community *****

Barc0de Mythical Member from Time Immemorial

rod_wod Fiery Member

Druidic teacher Officer at Arms

Yakumo Pillar of the Community *****

GigaDrive Enthusiastic Member

GigaDrive Enthusiastic Member

accel99 Spirited Member

Segafreak_NL v2.0 New and improved. Site supporter 2012-15

7Force Guardian of the Forum

GigaDrive Enthusiastic Member

Taucias Site Supporter 2014,2015

Druidic teacher Officer at Arms

Taucias Site Supporter 2014,2015

rod_wod Fiery Member

Yakumo Pillar of the Community *****

rod_wod Fiery Member

Juste Fiery Member

rod_wod Fiery Member

rod_wod Fiery Member

Share This Page

Early Saturn Game Screen shots

Yakumo Pillar of the Community *****

Barc0de Mythical Member from Time Immemorial

rod_wod Fiery Member

Druidic teacher Officer at Arms

Yakumo Pillar of the Community *****

GigaDrive Enthusiastic Member

GigaDrive Enthusiastic Member

accel99 Spirited Member

Segafreak_NL v2.0 New and improved. Site supporter 2012-15

7Force Guardian of the Forum

GigaDrive Enthusiastic Member

Taucias Site Supporter 2014,2015

Druidic teacher Officer at Arms

Taucias Site Supporter 2014,2015

rod_wod Fiery Member

Yakumo Pillar of the Community *****

rod_wod Fiery Member

Juste Fiery Member

rod_wod Fiery Member

rod_wod Fiery Member

Share This Page

Useful Searches