RGB DIY Cable Question. VGA/DB15 or Component YPbPr?

Hi Guys.. I'd like to keep the cable situation as simple and cheap as possible. I don't want to use any kind of SCART cable or adapter. I also do not wish to purchase any prefabbed cables at this time... Maybe down the road, yes! But right now this is a hobby/project of mine that i would like to enjoy building for a bit. I know how to solder and am familiar with PCB boards. I've already modded my SEGA Genesis to output Stereo Audio, composite and S-Video.

I understand that for RGB i'll need to add resistors/caps/etc. But i'd like to make the the hook up between the PVM and my retro consoles as simple as possible. I considered using a VGA/DB15 connector to connect the two. I would obviously have to create a female VGA/DB15 port on the back of my PVM as well as on the consoles. Is it as easy as adding the needed resistors/caps etc since the consoles?

The desired effect would be something like this


Or should i go with component/YPbPr (analog) instead?

 

If your PVM uses BNC connectors, perhaps it makes sense for you to installing BNC connectors (with proper capacitors) on your consoles too. Can't get any more simple than that. It's not the standardized way but at least it's consistent. It may not be a big deal for some, but I always felt using those component jacks or db15 connector can lead to confusion down the road (unless you are truly outputting component video in your mod when using RGB colored RCA jacks).

 

PVM-2530 doesn't except RGB via BNC, my PVM-1910q does thought. I left something out of my OP and that is I have a TON of VGA and component cables. I'd like to make some good use out of them or else they serve no other purpose that to sit in a box in my workshop. I'm just itching to use them somehow, lol. I also really like the look of either sticking out of the back of the console

On of my questions is can I put RGB through a VGA/DB15 connection? Also is RGB the same as component/YPbPr?

 

Component/YPbPr is derived from RGB. For RGB setup you will need a separate sync line. Component does not. VGA is RGBHV, which has two sync lines (horizontal and vertical). So if you wire DB15 for RGB you will have to make sure you assign one unused pin as your sync. These are the reasons why I said using those connectors can lead to confusion.

 

ah ha, Gotcha! Thank you for replying BuffaloWing. From what I've read so far if i want to play the console on the PVM then i'll need to add SYNC, but there is no mention of adding sync if say it were to go to a tv. Am I missing something here?

Asides from the two (2) PVM's that I have, i also have a Sony KV-27FV310 (I love this TV, it's awesome. Almost didn't get the PVM because games look so good on it via SVIDEO). I picked this up as per recommend by this article. It's an amazing TV with a built-in subwoofer and COMB FILTER. It has YPbPr in the rear, therefore if I went that route where would I add SYNC too? I've read that i can pull sync from composite (yellow rca), i believe they called it "CSYNC." Would that work? If so, where should the input be attached too, I assume one of the YPbPr cables.. I also read that I can add/make a SYNC stripper, to prevent any crosstalk, but it isn't always needed. Here are two (2) articles that explain how to make it RetroRGB and MMMonkey. However they are using it on a SCART cable (ugh) which ends up confusing me a bit because in my head stripping wires for the VGA is alot easier than YPbPr because you have more pins to use?

In conclusion I am confident that I can achieve my goal after better understanding my options here. I don't think it's outside my scope of understanding, it's just that there is so much information on this MOD on the web.

 

It astounds me how many people insist on installing mods in consoles that don't need them. The SNES offers RGB out natively - why not use it?

I know you said you don't want to use SCART, but the fact of the matter is that making the hook-up between your PVM and consoles as simple as possible is best achieved with a SCART adapter for your PVM.

 

No additional sync connection is required for consumer TVs that uses composite or component input. If your PVM supports component and say you are plugging in a PS2 via component, chances are the PVM will share the same BNC connectors used for RGB and component. There should be a button or on-screen menu option to toggle off external sync to get into component mode. In this case the fourth BNC connector marked as sync on the back of the monitor will be left unattached.

I'm not sure what other retro consoles you are planning to hook up, in general anything before the PS2 era do not output YPbPr natively with maybe the exception of certain revisions of larger design of SNES/SFC. Even with that said, a mod is required to coax them to output the signal. If you are going to use YPbPr (component) on you KV-2FV310 for use with non-component native consoles, the easy way is perhaps to use one of those SCART RGB to component boxes (CYS-2100). But that does require SCART connection that you didn't want (unless you mod that too).

As far as for sync stripper, that is more about purifying the sync signal (raw vs. composite) for certain set-up where the RGB monitor have trouble interpreting the incoming signal.

Like you said, if you know what's going on and have everything plan out for all the systems you own, devising your own non-conventional cabling should work. At the end of the day you are just using non-standardized connectors for the task. If you don't see yourself selling these systems in the future it's not a big deal.

 

Hi Retro.. Yes, an RGB scart cable would be a very quick and easy solution, but I much rather have the option to use component cables or VGA instead. I have a ton of switches for that kind of cable format and an abundance of cables as well. Also as i mentioned in my 1st post, i enjoy modding. I'm really looking forward to starting this project... but I am a realist and if SCART is the way to go and this ends up being more trouble than it's worth, than i'll just stop right there and begin work on my 1975 RD350 instead. lol

Thanks BuffaloWing. After your response I am left thinking that this might all be for nothing and that perhaps i am complicating things by wanting to use the non-standardized connectors. Perhaps SCART Cable is something i should consider.. hmph...What i'm really after is getting each console to display at its' best! Perhaps you could tell me what the best approach here?
I have the following consoles:

• TurboGrafx-16
• Sega Dreamcast
• Sega Saturn
• Sega 32x
• Sega CD
• Sega Genesis Model 1
• Sega Genesis Model 2
• Sega Master System
• NES (Toaster)
• NES (Top Loader)
• SNES Model 1 (Fat)
• SNES Model 2 (Slim)
• N64 (RGB compatible model)
• GameCube (with EXT port)
• 3DO
• Colecovision
• Atari 2600
• PS1 (Fat)
• PS1 (Slim)
• PS2 (Fat)
• PS2 (Slim)

 

Is space an issue for you? Do you plan to make both PVMs and the consumer TV available for use at the same time? If you are going to hook everything (excluding the redundant systems and use all three SONY screens) you are still going to need multiple switches. If all three screens are available for use maybe dedicate certain system for a particular screen. Both of your PVMs accept the DB25 connector, so definitely build yourself a DB25 to SCART/BNC/MiniDin8 adapter for each. If you stick to one of the last three connectors and wire accordingly you are at least following some RGB convention. Use S-video (if possible) on systems that are not high on your list.

If I am you:

• Sega Dreamcast: VGA for best output (assuming you can toss in a LCD screen in the mix) or use S-Video for compatibility on the TV or on the PVM-2530.
• Gamecube: Wait for someone to perfect the commercialization of GCvideo and connect it to your KV-27FV310's component in.
• PS2 (Fat/Slim): Use component on KV-27FV310. PS2 component cable is cheap and readily available on ebay. Forget PS1 and use PS2 for backward countability and have one less system to hook up.
• NES: Do the NESRGB mod from Tim Worthington and use the PVM. Shameless plug: use the 3D printed sockets that Helder and I developed for cleaner install.
• Genesis: Depending on your affinity to either model, on which CD attachment you own, 32x attachment, will probably be RGB or S-video connection on PVM, the KV or even component mod.
• SNES: Everyone swear by the mini for RGB unless you go with component mod if your model 1 is capable.
• Master system and Saturn: RGB on PVM. If you have Master system II you will need additional mod.
• N64 and TG16: RGB on PVM or at least S-video on KV. Maybe component mod.
• 3DO/Colecovision/Atari 2600: I don't follows those systems much at all.

 

Hi BuffaloWing. Thank you so much for your reply. Holiday shopping and spending time with friends and family has somewhat slowed down my response time and modding time. I really appreciate the list with the breakdown of what connection is best/available for each system. 25pin to MiniDin8/serial port seems like it would do the trick. That would most likely be the route i would take to stay with in the RGB convention.

Thing is that I love my KV-27FV310 it's a great TV, consoles look great on it no matter what connection. Space isnt' an issue, but the more i think about it i don't know if i want the PVM to be the main monitor/TV; now that i know i can get RGB > YPbPr on the back of my KV. Ugh! It would be great if i could go that route as I like the way the KV looks, sounds, video is clear and light guns work spot-on!

If i'm not able to do that RGB > YPbPr, then ill just use the RGB (native) consoles on the PVM and the rest on the KV.

On a side note, i do have (2) KV-27FS170's, I plan on using one for a MAME arcade cabinet that i'd like to build during the summer. The additional KV was free and therefore will be stored as a backup.

p.s. your 3D printed socket looks great. Awesome idea! Anything is possible now that consumers can get their hands on 3D printing.

 

Is there more information on this. I'm interest is peeked!

 

The last time I check some folks on gcforever forum had build them for testing. There is also a thread on Shump forum.

 

I normally use a D9 connector on my consoles for RGB out, as its the standard for CGA/EGA, and is what the Commodore 1084s monitor I have uses..
So I'm standardizing everything across my 15Khz game consoles and Amigas...

I have a scart to ypbpr converter, that I've added two D9 connectors and a switch onto, so I can connect two consoles and switch between the two, however, I would like to build something from scratch that has at least 4 inputs, and switches both audio and video, once again using D9 connectors as the standard, and outputting ypbpr for use on modern tvs (as its an easy conversion to do, and requires no analog to digital conversion)

 

Just a bit off suggestion if you're dead keen on using a
component connection. How about install a D-SUB connector on the console instead or three component RCA connectors? It would be a lot smaller and tidier. Obviously, D-SUB isn't used outside of Japan, but the signel is exactly the same as component. You could use a D-SUB to component cable, no need for converters!

 

Are you talking about d-terminal FireAza.

 

Yeah! That one! Looks like a little vga connector!

 

I once saw a d-terminal cable at my local goodwill,think I was the only person who knew what it was - haha

Another alternative for component is to use a trrs jack and a 3.5mm av cable.

 

That's a great idea! I'm looking to do the RGB NES mod at some point, but I don't want to chop up the case to fit a SNES connector. A TRRS jack would fit quite nicely into the existing hole for the RF connector. I did a similar thing for the Famicom av mod and it looked quite neat. Do they make any 6 pole 3.5 TRRS jacks? That way you could have the video and the audio on one cable!