Soldering

Discussion in 'Off Topic Discussion' started by la-li-lu-le-lo, Feb 5, 2011.

  1. la-li-lu-le-lo

    la-li-lu-le-lo ラリルレロ

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    I am able to solder, but when I do it it's incredibly inaccurate and I very often make mistakes. The soldering iron I have is plastic about halfway to the tip, and all the rest is metal, which is as hot as the tip. So basically wielding it is like trying to write with a pencil that you're only able to grip from the middle.

    What I really don't understand is how people are able to solder microchips - chips with pins that are about 1mm away from one another. When I try to solder something it shakes too much (for the aforementioned reason) and the solder itself moves around in a much too unpredictable way that I could never solder something with that level of accuracy. How is it done?

    The reason I'm asking about this is because I'd like to do a N64 RGB mod, but I have no idea how.
     
  2. Disjaukifa

    Disjaukifa Intrepid Member

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    I ran into the same problem when I chipped a PSX SCPH-9000, I ended up buying a small 15W Electronics Soldering Iron from Radio Shack, its much smaller and lighter, but it made my life 10x easier when it can to soldering the wires to the various points on the playstation board.

    Here is what I got: RadioShack® Electronic and Hobby Soldering Kit

    I'm not saying its the cheapest, but I didn't want to wait and it worked extremely well.

    -Disjaukifa
     
  3. Alchy

    Alchy Illustrious Member

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    Don't apply solder directly to the board. Get a small amount of solder on the end of the wire (just enough to colour the wire, not a fat ball), press it against the leg on the chip... that's pretty much all there is to it. It's fiddly work but not technically complicated. Practice on something that's broken, you'll get the hang of it in no time.
     
  4. n64coder

    n64coder Robust Member

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    practice on old boards is good. Use flux. Heat the wire/pad and apply solder to it. Don't melt the solder with the iron.

    I have this one:
    [​IMG]
     
  5. retro

    retro Resigned from mod duty 15 March 2018

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    Find a trace from the chip.

    In answer to how people solder chips with fine pins, they use proper SMT gear, e.g. IR setups, not a soldering iron.

    Use a fine tip, a decent temperature-controlled iron, some nice single core wire and some thin solder. If you're going to solder to the wire then apply the wire and heat, be careful - that can lead to dry joints and poor adhesion.
     
  6. marshallh

    marshallh N64 Coder

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    Soldering requires tools and technique.

    The biggest mistake I see people making is putting solder on the tip of the iron (pointless) and then trying to heat up the connection. It doesn't work that way. The iron is just there to heat up the interconnection. The connection itself should be what you add the solder to.

    The exception to this is tinning/cleaning the tip.

    I actually prefer soldering SMD because it's simpler, and desoldering goes a lot quicker. People assume it's harder just because everything is so much more dense. Wrong!

    These are my two irons.
    [​IMG]

    Each one costs $80 but has paid for itself many times, they can work where a regular iron won't (example: installing my car PC in a parking lot)

    The way I solder SMD with a normal iron is easy. Here's all you need
    - Iron at least 30 watts
    - Fine electrical solder
    - Copper solder wick
    - Flux pen

    Flood all the pins with solder, then wick up the excess. With some practice you can run the iron along the edge of the pins while feeding solder, and have the flux carry the solder blob onto the last pin, so you barely have to wick any off.

    With those irons above I have soldered all the parts on this [link] (QFP208, TSOP54)

    Desoldering with a regular iron: For through-hole, forget it. Buy a radioshack through-hole desoldering iron.
    For SMD, generally you can desolder two-sided packages with some patience. I have desoldered TSOP48 packages this way. You flood both sides with a large amount of solder. Then you melt one side, pry up that side very carefully. You will lift it maybe 1/2mm. Repeat for the other side and work it on up.
    It IS possible to desolder quad packages this way, but it requires a very hot iron (>60W) and lots of patience/swearing. I have desoldered the qfp208 fpga in the link above with that butane iron, and about 2 feet of solder.

    If you need to take off a large QFP package or do volume work, look into a SMD rework station. I have an Aoyue 968 and it takes off that qfp208 in about 10 seconds.
     
  7. Disjaukifa

    Disjaukifa Intrepid Member

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    That what I ended up doing, I accidentally destroyed PSOne board, so I ended up practicing with thew new Soldering Iron I got on it for a good 30 minutes before I went to my good board, wasted a good amount of solder, but I got it right the first time when I went to do it on my good board.

    Its similar to welding, in the aspect that the more you do it, the better you get.

    -Disjaukifa
     
  8. Cyantist

    Cyantist Site Supporter 2012,2013,2014,2015

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    That doesn't apply to me as I still always make a mess!
     
  9. Tatsujin

    Tatsujin Officer at Arms

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    weller is the best you can get, but also the most expensive. get a variety of different tips (size) and use an iron w/ temp. regulation.

    the rest is practice and a shake-free hand.

    there are millions of tuts on the netz.
     
  10. APE

    APE Site Supporter 2015

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    The short, simple answer: don't do it if you can't afford to replace whatever it is you are soldering to!

    The slightly longer answer: you need a LOT more practice before you're ready to tackle the N64 RGB mod if you're having to ask how its done (no offense intended). It has taken me a decade of experience to properly solder virtually anything that comes across my hands as well as a top notch Weller soldering iron. Learning how to use flux as well as what others have pointed out (solder goes to the joint, not the iron) is key to soldering.

    Practice is the only way to perform that mod without destroying your N64 in the process.
     
  11. retro

    retro Resigned from mod duty 15 March 2018

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    There are actually irons a LOT more expensive than Weller - and some that pros would swear by over Weller. I still love my Weller, though. I only ever use the one bit, suits me fine. I used to change bits on my old Antex, and I hated doing it - after a while, it affected the performance.
     
  12. alecjahn

    alecjahn Site Soldier

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    Weller is the Toyota. Big big thumbs-up. But there is always the Lexus...


    Get different tips. Watch the high quality youtube videos about technique that aren't immediately filled with comments comprising >50% complaints and disagreements.
     
  13. la-li-lu-le-lo

    la-li-lu-le-lo ラリルレロ

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    Hm... maybe I should just pay for someone else to do the mod.
     
  14. ASSEMbler

    ASSEMbler Administrator Staff Member

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    The key is to use flux. Don't trust the solder to flow properly. Modern non-lead solder does not flow properly and needs heavy assistance.
     
  15. retro

    retro Resigned from mod duty 15 March 2018

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    So this is more about the N64 mod than soldering now?

    Where are you based? I assume you're American and have the correct (early) NTSC N64, otherwise this conversation is pointless anyway. The mod isn't for PAL consoles or later NTSC ones.
     
  16. Tatsujin

    Tatsujin Officer at Arms

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    Sure there is always something more expensive etc. but Weller is IMO expensive enough, and also far well enough for approx. 99.998% of all solder works any peeps in here ever will be able to do.
     
  17. marshallh

    marshallh N64 Coder

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    Lead-free solder is shit, you'd be silly not to use leaded.
     
  18. la-li-lu-le-lo

    la-li-lu-le-lo ラリルレロ

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    I'm not sure about which version they are, because I don't have them here with me. I have 2 of them, though, so odds are one of them is the correct version. And yes, I'm in the US, and they're both NTSC models.

    Also, I'm still interested in soldering, but maybe not for that purpose.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2011
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