Strange HDTV 'Issue'? Bending Vertical Lines?

Hi,

Am I going crazy or is this commonplace?

on my HDTV I just put on Sonic 2 from the XBLA. Running full pelt in the first stage, the orange palm tree trunks seem to 'bend'; they seem to be 'diagonal' rather than perfectly vertical as they should be.

I don't get why this would be? Obviously there is some motion blur but surely it should just leave a trail of the vertical tree? I may have noticed it in other games- like shooters, say, look at a vertical point (such as a wall) and then rock the aim right to left- the wall appears to 'bend' slightly. I can't recall which game this was in or if it is even common across all games.

Could it be the way that Sonic 2 on the XBLA is emulated? Or is my TV just funky? Which I would be a total freaking arse as it has been perfect in every other way and I have only just noticed this =(

 

are you on a dlp

 

No, it's an LCD screen. All the stupid motion smoothing crap is turned off. I don't use Game Mode, but even with Game Mode ON, it still persists. Should it be doing this? Tbh, I think I can see it on the Dashboard squares when holding LB/RB.

Shit, I'm gutted, I don't want to have to send this back- cus this is going to bug the hell out of me..

Edit:
Just hooked up my old TV and Sonic 2 does the same thing. It must be the game or the nature of HDTV.. I guess I notice it more because this TV is bigger.. I don't think I noticed it on the dashboard as much but I guess its the same reason.

Le sigh, I hate HDTVs..

 

well I mean, it is upscaling from a pretty small resolution (280p)

Are you stretching the scene to fill the screen or running in 4:3

 

x

 

Correction: Genesis/Mega Drive games are 240p. Also, the 360 is probably doing most or all of the scaling, not the TV.

What kind of screen is your "old TV"? The trees definitely are supposed to be straight. If it happens on more than one TV, it could be your 360. Another important detail: are the trees always bent, or just when they're moving?

EDIT: Out of curiosity, I checked to see if the trees were bent on my display (a 32" LCD). They weren't.

 

Both are HDTV running at 1080p through HDMI. It isnt a break- not a vsync style 'tear' but the trees literally bend, like \ rather than a straight ¦. It doesn't screenshot or video well at all =/ They only 'bend' when moving. The bend occurs in the the opposite direction when you run the otherway. It is as if the screen refreshes progressibly slower towards the bottom of the image.. I don't get why it would occur the same on two televisions.. It does it regardless of apect ration (4:3 or 16:9, enforced by either the TV or the game).

Oh just to clarify this is the XBLA version running on my 360..

Edit:

When I get a chance I will try the same game through a Component connection.. then on a different 360. See if I can eliminate what it is. I played entirely through Sonic 2 on my old TV (HD through VGA at 1080p) and I can't say I ever noticed it on that TV.. Wondering if it is the HDMI connection somehow..?

 

What brand are your TVs? Many people seem to think the the cheaper brand TVs have the same image as the expensive brands because it's all digital but this is not the case. I have the trial of Sonic 1 for the 360 and that looks fine on my TV at 1080p and also just for the sake of it checked through 1080p on the downstairs TV and through my capture card. All seem fine. So either your eyes are deceiving you, your TV isn't up to the job or your HDMI on the 360 (or cable) is not what it should be.

Yakumo

 

Its a Samsung 32". I looked at my dads TV and Xbox.. you can observe the exact same in the dashboard by scrolling right and left. Thats a 19" Samsung over HDMI. I swear blind it bends. I think I am overly fussy, sure, but hell, it bugs me.. =(

 

Ironic given that Samsung are the official TV partner of Xbox in Europe...

To solve your problem, you should hook up a Megadrive via RGB to a SCART based TV and play Sonic on that and marvel on how quick it loads and how crisp, sharp and pretty it looks :lol:

 

x

 

druid II may be right on that. Try turning off all filters on both Samsung TVs. Or better still, anyone here with a Samsung and 360 willing to test out Sonic 1? You can download the trial for free.

 

I have the full version and a samsung TV, doesnt do that on mine

 

It does it on two HDTVs (Samsung 32", LG 24"). I can see it on the dashboard of my Dad's XBox 360 on a Samsung 19". The LG and Samsung 19" have no filters to enable, my 32" has all disabled and game mode enabled makes no difference either.

FML, I think either I have super-amazing eyes/truly fuckered eyes, or I'm just a fussy sod. Heh!

 

x

 

I don't think it's either of them. I'm a fussy bugger as well who would notice something like that. There must be some sort of interference from somewhere to alter the image.

 

It makes me think it is the nature of the display- after all, they are -progressive- and doesnt that mean each line is updated in turn?So I guess it would make sense, as the lines towards the bottom are updated after the ones at the top.

But I can see it on three televisions... and across two Xboxs (One Pro, One Elite) If I ask anyone else if they can see it, it is a firm 'No You are being stupid' but I can see it for sure.

I have been through Xbox settings and have just tried like, RGB or the other options over HDMI. I haven't tried a different cable I admit, but since it does it on my Dads different TV and different Xbox with a different brand of HDMI lead I don't particularly see a reason to. I'm annoyed enough to just leave it, lol. I haven't tried another console either, when I am less angry I may do that with an N64 or whatever I have to hand..

 

I have a samsung TV i got free from my parents.

While it was at their place the picture was terrible. It then broke, I got it and found all the display settings to be corrupt.

Removed the eeprom, erased, refitted and then setup the TV using the service menu + service manual and the picture is better than it was from new.

 

thats a good idea try getting into service menu and see if you can futz with it
or upgrade the firmware on the TV depending on how old the tv is most tvs in the last few years support firmware upgrades

even for NON web connected tvs

 

No, that's not what progressive means. Progressive (which used to be called "non-interlaced") means the image is not interlaced - i.e. the entire image is displayed at once. An interlaced image is one that has been split into 2 "fields" - basically a series of even and odd horizontal bands that fill the screen. An interlaced image alternates between the 2 fields so rapidly that the viewer usually perceives it as a single image. In contrast, a progressive image shows the whole picture (both even and odd fields) at once.

In reference to what you say about how "each line is updated in turn", LCDs do not do this. The whole image is displayed at the same time. A CRT, however, does have to scan the image from top to bottom because the electron gun in the back of the device shoots out a narrow stream of electrons which must sweep across the screen to show the whole image.

In short, the "nature of the display" probably does not explain the problem you're describing. Possibly the image processing hardware inside the TV does, but that's a separate issue.

That's not surprising. Most people don't notice this sort of thing. Hell, most people can't tell the difference between SD and HD unless it's pointed out to them.

It might be helpful if you took a video of the issue you're describing.

Another thing occurred to me: what resolution are you outputting from the 360? If you're using an interlaced format (i.e. 480i or 1080i), it's possible the chip doing the deinterlacing in the TV is distorting the image. If so, you should try a progressive output (i.e. 480p, 720p, or 1080p).