64DD Dissection

Discussion in 'General Gaming' started by Barc0de, May 20, 2007.

  1. Barc0de

    Barc0de Mythical Member from Time Immemorial

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    I guess that would constitute fair use of such a unit =)
     
  2. subbie

    subbie Guardian of the Forum

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    Oh. -_-

    I need a dev unit to toy on (coding, not breaking open).
     
  3. DarthCloud

    DarthCloud Fiery Member

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    I should get mine (Retail 64DD) today normaly (if rain stop a little)

    I would like to try disabling the IPL
    but since blue dev seen to be useless, I think getting a retail 64DD to work as a dev one still a useless thing at the end...

    I don't have a DCC board/ipl4rom/masteredBlueDisk anyway to test it after....
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2008
  4. kammedo

    kammedo and the lost N64 Hardware Docs

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    DCC Board you dont need, you need ipl4rom and at least one disk.
    The differences between the two systems arent that clear up to today. The SDK states clearly that they are different, and that disks from one kind shouldnt be used for the other one.

    I dont think that the only difference between the retail and dev unit is the DDROM, so I would be very careful on that side...
    Can I add your msn contact?

     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2008
  5. Barc0de

    Barc0de Mythical Member from Time Immemorial

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    you just cant use a DEV DD as a retail one and the other way around - issue being the disks are incompatible between the two, not the IPL.
     
  6. kammedo

    kammedo and the lost N64 Hardware Docs

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    Not sure about that. File format should be the same actually, HW is different IMO. Thats why the Debugger doesnt dump retail disks but just dev ones..
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2008
  7. DarthCloud

    DarthCloud Fiery Member

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    Just got my 64DD, wow it's even more awesome machine than I tought is was!!! :D

    Everything work.

    I did some test like I have said to kammedo so the result:

    Like I have tought US OOT v1.0 (NUS-CZGE-USA) (gold cart) do not work.
    I tought it will at least give me en error message, but it just won't boot at all.
    I think that the cart when booting look for a US 64DD unit and find a JAP one and them stop with black screen.

    I also tried a US OOT v1.1 (NUS-CZLE-USA) with the exact same result :(

    So I'm going to try to find a US OOT v1.2 (NUS-NZLE-USA) (player's choice cart) All the 64DD code should be removed it that version.

    I don't want to remove my 64DD everytime I want to play the greatest game in history in english ;)

    I never see this information somewhere before, but maybe this issue I'm describing is well know to 64DD owner....
     
  8. kammedo

    kammedo and the lost N64 Hardware Docs

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    Great to see you have a working unit! Jump over at 64dd to post your s/n! :)

    As for Zelda, well, Ninty hardly could had thought about releasing the 64DD to USA, so i dont think thats the reason. Maybe its more a CIC issue.

     
  9. DarthCloud

    DarthCloud Fiery Member

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    It's not related to CIC at all, since US and JAP system/cart share the exact same CIC, The only different between JAP and US N64 stuff is that the cart plastic casing is a bit different so jap game cannot be connected to a US system and virce-versa, Removing the two little plastic edge inside N64 deck solve this problem.

    Also, nintendo did make a lot of avertasing in '97 - '98 for the 64DD on their offcial US website.

    If you look to the 64DD IPL chip you can see -JPN at the end.

    So OOT look for a 64DD US IPL for sure.

    EDIT: (I'm confident of this, but it's just speculation of course...)
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2008
  10. Barc0de

    Barc0de Mythical Member from Time Immemorial

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    indeed, coding guides suggest different headers for US and JPN games, set manually at low level.
     
  11. DarthCloud

    DarthCloud Fiery Member

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    I looked at the IPL rom and the region is write in the header in both the name and region space.

    I going to buy an 32Mbit (4Mb x 8) eprom and will modify the header so it's contain USA and E in the name and region field respectively.

    I'm wondering if OOT look there to determine the 64DD region.

    (I'm taking as fact that zelda actualy won't boot cause it detect a JAP 64DD, but again this is just speculation maybe US OOT just don't like the DD after all ;) )
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2008
  12. Barc0de

    Barc0de Mythical Member from Time Immemorial

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    When a gamepak supports the 64DD then it will refer to the DDROM at domain 2, when needed, which is usual to be on boot - I believe your assumption might be correct.
     
  13. DarthCloud

    DarthCloud Fiery Member

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    Domain 2? Is that meen Slot-1 (aka. DD Slot)?
     
  14. subbie

    subbie Guardian of the Forum

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    I did some checkint into Zelda. It does actualy read from IPL space at the start. This is a sharp difference from F-Zero which checks the DD status reg first before trying to communicate with the DD.

    I am guessing Zelda does 1 read to see if the IPL addr start returns an invalid address. If it dont then it later (before the nintendo 64 logo) does a second read of the IPL (again prior to any cmd writen to DD regs).
    The 2nd addr is not a header read and i've not been able to get much further then that last night (out of time).

    So a change of the rom header name to (U) from (J) most likely wont fix the issue at hand.

    I'll do more checks to see what is required to make OOT (u) work (I was testing OOT (J) against no ipl (i dont emulate ipl yet).
     
  15. DarthCloud

    DarthCloud Fiery Member

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    Cool, keep me informed, I should receive the stuff needed to replace the IPL IC so if you can find what OOT is looking for and where it is in the ipl rom that would be great to try out on real hardware what happen.
     
  16. kammedo

    kammedo and the lost N64 Hardware Docs

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    Not actually.
    The N64 defines two so-called "Domains", which are nothing more than memory areas mapped to the PI - the Cart and DD slot.
    Now, this is needed because you can connect different devices to the PI (cart, DD, etc) everyone of them has different access timings etc. By settling up domains, you can define such parameters for each domain.

    0x0500 0000 to 0x05FF FFFF Cartridge Domain 2 Address 1
    0x0600 0000 to 0x07FF FFFF Cartridge Domain 1 Address 1
    0x0800 0000 to 0x0FFF FFFF Cartridge Domain 2 Address 2
    0x1000 0000 to 0x1FBF FFFF Cartridge Domain 1 Address 2

    there you go :)
    Remember, those are physical adresses!
     
  17. Japan-Games.com

    Japan-Games.com Well Known Member

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    I'll be sending the unit to kammedo on Friday. You can direct any questions to him.

    For the record I'm lending the item and paying for shipping. You're free to do what you want for research. If you reach a point where you feel like you've "finished" then please pass it along, even if it's not working at that point.
     
  18. Barc0de

    Barc0de Mythical Member from Time Immemorial

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    Although I m not a privy party to this agreement (yet at least) I agree on the terms, they seem fair for their purpose.

    I m certain kammedo will take good care of the unit even when he's slaughtering it, he's a magician =)
     
  19. kammedo

    kammedo and the lost N64 Hardware Docs

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    Thank you japan-games! I hope this helps to clarify up some things! :)
     
  20. DarthCloud

    DarthCloud Fiery Member

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    Just tryed an US OOT v1.2 same result as v1.0 and v1.1 :(
     
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