Holy shit! Lindbergh! (VF5 specifically)

Original thread which might get updates.

 

Hello,
Hardware info and games screenshots:
http://www.system16.com/hardware.php?id=731

The official website:
http://www.sega.co.jp/arcade/lindbergh/

Nice machine indeed!

 

Those screenshots do it absolutely zero justice. The common conception of VF5 was that "it's not a huge graphical advancement" even though the poly count is clearly higher. Shit, I said that after seeing the video of it at the AM Show in September. Eating my words now.

 

Long live the arcade scene! Great news indeed, I'm excited about the possiblities that exist with Lindbergh.

 

oooh how i want one

that machine is awesome, can't wait for the next generation cabs using it

 

Thanks for that gaijinpunch, can't wait to get my hands on that this summer - not that far now!

Though this kind of thing does hint to a problem (if you want to call it that) in the future. Namely the decline of the small gamecenters in Japan.

All the time I see the lindbergh in action, while it looks amazing, I can't help thinking that it is going to cost a small fortune once you have had to buy the new hd screens to go with it. This means that only your big arcades are going to be able to have them, nothing new I know, the big expensive cabs have always gone to the 3 story places (or round ones!).

My local in Osaka had not even upgraded to the flat screens that KOF neowave is meant to use. They only had a couple of atomiswave cabs anyway, they were just too expensive for the arcade. But they did have every recent shooter/fighter that one can think of, tons of older games, basically it was my kind of place. Always busy, always a vs match to be had and a really good crowd and event scene. This is the kind of game center I worry about losing, as they rely on games for cheap cabs.

Anyway with the coming of the lindbergh hardware we may see an even bigger gap between the small and big time game centers. If Cave, Taito, Snk and Sammy don't come up with the goods to keep the cheaper cabs alive we may just see a lot of smaller places go before long. Either that or become prikura/ufo heavens with a cursory pop'n/beatmania machine out front.

Maybe those cheap cabs will find homes as parts of pachislot places, either way - I hope they find a place somewhere.

All that said... Bring on the lindbergh, it looks awesome!

 

I think Taito is taking the right approach finding a happy medium between versatility and low cost with their Type X hardware. Such a system is necessary IMO now that the old Neo Geo MVS has been retired as well as the fact that Atomiswave hasn't been the big breakthrough Sammy/Sega had hoped.

From where I'm standing, there's always been a bit of a quality gap between the small/big game centers. Who can forget the Model 3 prices and all those deluxe cabs that only a few arcades had in any given area. I think the industry does need such high end devices to maintain interest and excitement while also catering to the regular gamer with affordable and less technically impressive cabs for 'normal' and tournament gaming.

I'm fortunate to have an arcade in my area that seems to get newer cabs on a regular basis, and I can tell you that it's a thrill to see a new game on display just like it was back in the day.

 

Warakia: One would think that the small guys will be fucked, but they're not really. A set of Net City cabs ran 400,000 new when they came out (roughly 5 years ago). Lindbergh are reported to run 600,000 new. More, yes, but obviously you get more with your money. While it may seem steep to pay $10k for a new VF5 setup, remember that there are people that have 10,000 losses on one of their VF cards. That's to say, after a few years, 1 person could easily pay off the machine.

I would be more worried about Afterburner more than anything. You will not see that in a small arcade, but VF5 will be everywhere.

SuperGrafx: Type-X works in theory. There's one problem though -- the games look like absolute SHIT. There's not been one stunning Type-X game (I've not seen Half Life yet), and there have been tons of graphical duds (Raiden III, Homura, Gigawing Generations, and the upcoming Shikigami no Shiro III which looks like shit from screenshots). Yes, they're all shooters, but 3 of them are sequels... in which their predecessors reportedly looked better on much weaker hardware. All that to boot -- TypeX boards are very expensive. They retail for over 300,000 yen, whereas brand new Naomi stuff is in the 180,000 range, and Cave's SH3 hardware retails for 248,000 yen. Lindbergh boards are reportedly starting in the 400,000 range. Roughly $1000 USD more for something that is clearly a superior product.

 

Admittedly the early releases for Type X are a bit lacking in the graphics dept, but I must say that Battle Gear 4 looks great, one of the most realistic racing games I've seen (in screenshots that is). If it plays even half as good as BG3, one would be in for a treat.

But yeah, the early stuff pales in comparison to what we're seeing for the Lindbergh thus far.

 

I'll keep an eye out for Battle Gear 4. Admittedly, my arcade titles of preferences are of a rather limited genre. Also, I'm of the group that thinks 3D is JUST NOW getting to look as nice as some of the high budget 2D stuff. Only a few current gen 3D titles floored me (Orta, Ninja Gaiden).

 

I completely understand your observations towards 3D, but yeah Battle Gear 4 has been covered rather regularly by Arcadia magazine and I just think it looks mind blowing. Had a chance to play BG3 a few months ago whilst on a business trip in Vancouver and I'd do just about anything to have a go on the new edition.

 

I played HoTD 4 today. It''s beautiful, yes, but it didn't floor me like VF5 did. I guess having the display so big takes a way a lot of the "glow", if you know what I mean. That, and I'm not such an HoTD fan in the first place. I also saw it at Hey! in Akihabara, which has basically every half-decent 2D shooter from the last 10 years on 1 floor. All Cave, Toaplan, and Raizing games, just for starters, so I was kind of busy working myself to really give it a chance.

 

OT Oh I love that "hey" place, always worth an hour or two. Going to a place like that makes you realize, even with a limited genre like shooters, just how much diversity the genre can offer.

As for HoTD4 I was not particularly amazed by the shaky vids that have popped up all over the place, still they usually save some of the best graphical set pieces for towards the end. How was the difficulty of it? I usually have found machine gun light gun games a little easier as they don't require the accuracy of say a six shot gun game.

And I did not realize that the lindbergh is (quite) reasonably priced, I thought it would be far more. Also it is certainly a good investment to get a couple of VF machines in. At my ex-local the Virtua fighter cabs were nearly always in use, as were most of the fighters actually. It did set itself up as a fighters kind of place, with shooters as a chill out option. However, the most popular machine was certainly Melty Blood, you had to fight to get a go on that! There were 6 MB machines in total - compared to just 2 GG, 2 KOF NW and 2 VF. Considering how cheap the game was to buy - they must have been making a bloody fortune!

As for Type X - it was a good idea and there certainly needs to be a new standard board set for games. However it has really not been used well enough. Looking at the stats it seems like they should be able to bring something graphically special on it. I personally really liked the look of Raiden III, it was appropriate for the series and very crisp graphically. But it does not blow you away, in the way under defeat or Espgaluda (II) does. The whole Type X seems like a giant missed chance to me.

OT - anyone played that Taito X game "Spica world" or something. Forgotten the name... It was a really pink platformer about a girl and her umbrella. I really liked it, just wondered if anyone else had played it while we are on the X angle. It was quite easy and the bosses had some shooter elements. I only played it at a loke then it dissapeared...

 

I don't know about Type X being a missed chance just yet, Taito to me seems commited to the platform. If there's anything that's failed to live up to expectations it has to be the Atomiswave...only out for 2-3 years and while the games are compelling, it seems to be on its way out already.

Whatever it takes to keep the arcade industry going (not in a DDR or Beatmania sense either), I'm all for it.

 

OT That - surprisingly good - pinky platformer is here http://www.taito.co.jp/gm/spica/ Good use of the hardware - but nothing that special

For more Type X love try - http://www.taito.co.jp/gm/chaosbreaker/index.html A odd fighter, odd design and odd item system. Played this quite a bit in Japan, though it was hilariously unpopular. More so that Spectral VS generation! But worth a go, every now and then.

OK so maybe "missed chance" was a bit too strong, I just don't think it has been the graphical leap to justify the price tag. Which Lindbergh almost certainly is! I would just like to see more sprite based games on it. Chaos breaker does them quite well, so why not more fighters or sprite based shooters?

Looking at the new shikigami 3 screens it seems to suffer from the same graphical issues that most of the other type X have had. Namely while crisp and well clipped they just seem bland with a lack of detail or interesting effects.

And yes atomiswave is almost certainly far bigger a wasted chance. Oddly I think the best thing to come out of that setup is the rumblefish (2), that just looks cool and plays well once you are used to it. That is the single game that reeks of effort and detail. Oh well at least it has kept some of my favourite game series alive for another generation.

 

Never tried the pink platformer, but wanted to. Might hit that while I'm here. I agree though -- Atomiswave and Type-X both are duds. Atomiswave, being 15khz compatible, but games w/ low-res sprites being displayed in high res mode = shitty looking. Very jagged and crap. Type-X... just out-dated 3D polygons. Nothing that can't be done on the Xbox or GC (thus far anyway).

I would like to say that Sega is taking us to the generation where arcades are at least a generation ahead of the console, but some people are telling me that DOA4 is prettier than VF. I would buy it... DOA has always been about glitz, and VF about the fighting/engine.

 

I liked Raiden III ( i got the PS2 port).

As for Atomiswave, i hope they release a home port of "Dolphin Blue"

 

Would be nice, but that game's a few years old now so chances are pretty slim.
At least the recent AW SNK fighting games are trickling onto home consoles, so all is not lost.

 

Yeah Dolphin Blue was very playable indeed, I know a lot of people have written it off. But if you enjoy it without comparison to Metal Slug it is a solid enough game.

If I can do my mini list of games that I probably will not get to play at home -

Spica Adventure - 2D platformer - hurrah!
Chaos Breaker - it is a 2D fighter = I have no choice but to buy and enjoy.
Rumble Fish 2 - Give them time...
That sushi puzzler on atomiswave - try finding that in an arcade. It was an awesome looking game but disappeared about 5 minutes after release!

But to drag this one back on topic - do we reckon that VF5 will be coming to PS3 or 360? I'm assuming a version will at some point. (or maybe both)

 

Yeah I remember reading somewhere that Sushi Bar and Salary Man Champ both appeared and promptly disappeared from Japanese game centers. Oddly enough, Sushi Bar got some decent reviews. Any idea why they're so scarce?