Machines that don't need an Everdrive

It's interesting reading through the topics re: machines that people wish had Everdrives, so I thought it would be interesting too to list the machines that don't need an Everdrive. Of course, you could argue that any machine (that could support an Everdrive) could benefit from one, and even if one existed then you're not bound to buy it, but I just think it would be good to list the machines that don't really need such a device, especially so so that any owners of those machines can learn (if they don't already know) how to simulate the job of an Everdrive on their machine(s).

I'm only listing consoles, as computers usually support large capacity storage systems by now (any computer that's reasonably popular, I mean, from the PC to the ZX Spectrum, C64, Commodore Amiga, Atari ST, etc) allowing you to run games from a hard drive or memory card/USB stick. Though perhaps some computers could do with an Everdrive, or equivalent, I don't know?

Anyway, the three consoles that (to me) don't need an Everdrive are the PS2, XBox 1 (original XBox), and the XBox 360, as all three of these can install and run their games from a hard drive. None of them are perfect in this regard, as the first two consoles have to be (hard or soft) modded, and the XBox 360 will only run games from the hard drive if the original game disc is in the disc drive,


PS2

With the PS2, you have the limitations that the console has to be the fat, black PS2 (slim PS2's don't support the hard drive), and you need a network card, Open PS2 Loader, FreeMCBoot, and almost any IDE hard drive (doesn't have to be an official Sony drive). Both pieces of software are free, but initially you need a way to run these that bypasses the PS2's boot check, so a mod chip, or HD Loader (a more primitive version of Open PS2 Loader, but on an official PS2 disc, so it will boot OK) or similar are needed, see the following web pages for details.

http://freemcboot.info/

http://psx-scene.com/forums/f150/open-ps2-loader-project-v0-9-a-62141/

When you've set everything up, then when you boot the PS2 up with no disc in the drive, then the PS2 boots from the memory card, via FreeMCBoot, and you can load Open PS2 Loader, and you get a listing of every game on your hard drive, and you can load and play the games. Most games support Open PS2's in game reset feature, which is where, if you press a combination of buttons on the joypad, then the PS2 resets, loads FreeMCBoot, and you can load Open PS2 Loader and choose another game. Not every game supports in game reset, so oyu can turn it off for those games, and not ever game works on the PS2's hard drive, but compatibility is very good (every game I've tried works) and is improving constantly as work continues on it. You get several compatbility options to try for the more difficult games, see the web page for help.

Lastly, using Open PS2 Loader, some games support a virtual memory card feature, where the games read/write the gamesaves to the hard drive, thinking it's really a memory card, which is very convenient.

I understand you can run all of the PS2's homebrew from the hard drive too, but I've not tried any, other than the programs I've named here and ULaunchElf (http://freemcboot.info/ule.html) which is a file browser.



XBox

With the XBox 1 (not the XBox 360) you need the XBox to be modded, either with a modchip (known as hard modded) or via one of a few methods of softmodding, which is where you only alter what is on the XBox's hard drive. I know nothing about the latter, but for all things to do with the XBox, go to xbox-scene.com and look through their FAQs and forums, as they are the experts when it comes to hacking the XBox. When the XBox is modded (soft or hard) you install the software, preferably using a custom made disc of XBox utilities (such as Slayers, again XBox Scene has all the information you need), and you install a dashboard replacement (Evo-X, UnleashX, XMBC, etc) and DVD2XBox, which is the software I use (there might be others) to install XBox games to the XBox. Every XBox game works from the hard drive, unlike the PS2 there are no compatibility options or incompatible games.

You can run all XBox homebrew too from the hard drive, and also any films/music/pictures via XBMC (XBox Media Centre, a fantastic media player). Plus you get access to lots of great emulators, running software for the SNES, Megadrive, ZX Spectrum, C64, Atari ST, Commodore Amiga, Neo-Geo, etc, and ports of open source games like Duke Nukem 3D, Doom 1 and 2, Quake 1, 2 and 3, etc.

All of the software is free, of course (though for some open source games you do need the original game disc to extract the game's data, only the XBox game engine is free to download), and the XBox supports ingame reset from the joypad (all games support it, as far as I know).



XBox 360

Finally, the XBox 360 straight out of the box will allow you to install your games to the hard drive and run them, and has done for quite a while now (it didn't originally, it was added with one of the periodic firmware/dashboard updates). Unlike the (modded) PS2 and XBox, you need to keep the game disc in when you play a game, so if you're a pirate or you've lost the disc then you can't use this feature (which is fair enough, it's just great that Microsoft (not my favourite company...) allow games to be installed and run from the hard drive - the XBox 1 didn't do this (unmodded, I mean), and I wish the PS3 allowed it, as not only is it more convenient as the loading is much faster and more reliable, but it also saves wear and tear on the DVD drive. The other downside is that you can't run homebrew stuff as the XBox 360 will only run 'official' game discs and downloads, which is a pity, but you can understand why, as otherwise it could be used to run pirate copies of the games.

Note that one advantage of being able to install a game to the hard drive (be it on the PS2, XBox 1, XBox 360, PC, etc) is that you know within minutes if the disc is damaged, as if it is, then the game installation will stop with an error. Whereas if you only play the game directly from the disc, then it could be days (or even years) before the machine is called upon to load data from the damaged part of the disc, by which time it might be much too late to take back to the shop. Being able to install a game to the hard drive allows you to check if all of the data on the disc is undamaged.

 

This thread seems rather odd given that all the systems are CD based. We might as well mention you don't need an EverDrive for the Tiger Handhelds.

Most major systems where a Flash Cartridge like the EverDrive could apply, already have an EverDrive developed. The only major system I can think of that lacks an EverDrive is the Gameboy. And it doesn't seem like there is a huge need for one with the very cheap and reasonably good performing 64M USB SmartCard carts. After Gameboy you are starting to really branch out to less main stream systems like, NeoGeo Pocket, NeoGeo MVS/AES, Wonderswan, Atari Jaguar..

 

The existence of flashcarts being available for a system hasn't stopped Krikzz before. And the 64M, as far as I know, only supports a very few save files at once, and it requires the use of a USB cable. I think there'd be a fair demand for a good GBC cart.

You could argue that no system has ever 'needed' an Everdrive, since a flashcart isn't a necessity by any means, it's a luxury.

 

Most of what you say is true minus one thing. You no longer need DVD2Xbox anymore for the mainstream replacement dashes. Unleash X and Evolution X both have a game DVD ripping tool built into them. At least the builds I have do. That's how I got some of my games to HDD.

And I'm not completely sure but I believe XBMC has it too.

While the custom install DVD is a good way to go, don't forget the good old memory card save state method combined with FTP. I got all my music, photos, videos, and applications on my box with FTP. Now I need emulators and ROMs.

Time for the replacement BIOS so I can use my 320 GB HDD. Gonna need it pronto...

 

True, the ones I mention are all disc based, but that's because all my consoles, other than the N64, are disc based. The N64 was the first console I bought, in 1998, and was the first console I ever owned, and I don't know of my own experience of any Everdrive-like backup devices for any other cartridge based machine.

Optical disc based systems have a much shorter average functioning life span than cartridge based consoles, due to the formers' moving parts and laser system, and would benefit enormously from an Everdrive style device to take the wear and tear of the disc drive out of the equation. I personally think that a Gamecube Everdrive would be great, but it would probably be better if it interfaced with a hard drive rather than an SD Card, for reasons of storage capacity.

From a technical point of view, is it more difficult to interface a backup device to a hard drive interface than to an SD Card interface? I know that a backup device for a disc based console is more complicated than a backup device for a cartridge based console, but assuming the backup device does exist (and works well) then I take it that making the device work with a hard drive (preferably SATA now, since IDE are becoming extinct) wouldn't be too difficult?

I've never used anything other than DVD2XBox, as it's transfered every game I have, and I'm too lazy or smart (so it's lazy then!) to try something new when the old one works for me. That's why I still use Evo-X as my dashboard when most people have moved on to XBMC, Avalaunch, UnleashX, etc, as I've had trouble before (mostly on the PC) when upgrading or replacing software with newer versions that introduce bugs or compatibility problems.

I use FTP sometimes to transfer stuff from the PC to the XBox and vice versa, it is very convenient. I don't need (or have) a memory card, I just use Evo-X and follow the (simple enough even for me) instructions at:

http://dwl.xbox-scene.com/~xbox/xbox-scene/tutorials/Networking_the_xbox.pdf

It's well worth it, but make sure that after you've upgdated the BIOS, you check the cluster size works on the hard drive, as it's possible that the first format of the drive won't work correctly - it didn't in my case;

quote "One final check that's worth doing before you start to put lots of files on the F partition is to check the cluster size - if the drive was previously formatted and was the same size then XBPartitioner 1.1 sometimes doesn't reformat with the right cluster size. Fire up Evox as an application, edit the skin / config so you can see the free space on F, then ftp a 1 byte file to the F drive. The drop in free space is the cluster size. If it's 16k then just run XBPartitioner 1.1 again, make partition 6 smaller (press D-pad left, or right, can't remember which), reformat, then start it again and make the partition bigger again, and reformat. Check again with the 1 byte file, just to be certain!" unquote from

http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=679729&st=0&p=4452694&#entry4452694


http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=706249

 

The slim pstwo can also use openps2loader, loading the games from a network share or USB. I wouldn't bother with USB because of the speed, but streaming the ISO's from a NAS is perfectly usable. I stopped using a fat PS2 because it was just too noisy.

The Wii can also run gamecube and wii games from USB.
The Dreamcast can run games from an SD card.

 

a good flash cart for the atari 2600 would be great, current ones on the market are very limited or discontinued / no steady supply. so although it already has flash carts out for it and therefore doesnt really need one, it could do with another one.

an alternative to the ps2 network adapter would be great
and a similar device for the saturn and dreamcast #icandream...

 

there are chinese ps2 network adapters with built-in SATA support. but the ones with a working ethernet drive are hard to find. it works great for me.

i need psx,dreamcast and sega saturn backup loaders. SD or hdd, doesn't matter. dreamcast sd loader isn't well for retail games now unfortunately.

 

An iso loader for the Dreamcast is being worked on ATM thanks to plenty of prodding from me on the Dreamcast forum here. I now want a loader for Saturn and Mega CD.

 

What's wrong with the Harmony cart from AtariAge?

http://psio.com.au

SD loader for PS1. Not yet finished, but in late prototype stages. They're hoping to support Saturn and DC later on.

 

i hope psio succeeds. there is a lot of drama going around it.

 

It already exists: http://www.gc-forever.com/wiki/index.php?title=Ide-exi

 

I released a new SmartCard menu that allows for the 64M SmartCard to have up to 11 save games at once. True it uses a USB cable and has just 64M (8 megabytes) or storage space but it's very affordable, with just a cart or two you'd have quite a collection of games. Obviously MicroSD storage would let you have every single game ever made but KRIKzz can only do so many different things at once.

 

Dios Mios, Devolution, or the WODE is a much better solution for gamecube game loading.

Even though it's disc-based, I would kill for a Saturn solution for loading games through a hdd. In fact, I'm considering offering a $500 bounty for the team who can do it.

 

Thanks for the information re: Gamecube backup devices, I'll have to look them up, and also see what prototype and never-released rom files are available for it.

 

I want a flash cart for me toaster and car.

What about the Everdrive attracts these pointless threads? Anyone can tell disc based consoles can't use a flash cart so why bother with a thread about it?

Replacing the optics is not a flash cart solution either.

GameCube ROMs? There are no carts for the cube my good man and thus no ROMs.

 

^ Exactly. Replacing optical drives is typically referred to as "CD-ROM emulator" or "DVD-ROM emulator" or what ever disc type the system uses.

Consoles like Xbox don't even need these things since they already have mass storage built in (or easily modded in as is case for classic Xbox). They just need a bit of software to load games from the storage.

Unleash X dashboard for classic Xbox can load games straight from the HDD and even rip them from a disc to HDD.


EDIT: And FYI for the noobs here, what you refer to as "ROM" for disc based system is typically called "ISO image". After all, the rips ARE disc images (usually...) and the ISO format is most commonly used.

 

It's not pointless, as it's interesting. If you don't find the thread interesting then don't read it or post in it.

And disc based machines can use flash carts, they have to be more complex from a technical side, true, but they can exist (apparently the Dreamcast already has one, for example, and there's one being made for the Playstation).



[/QUOTE]Replacing the optics is not a flash cart solution either.[/QUOTE]

If it facilitates the use of a flash cartridge then by definition it is.

There are Gamecube ROMs, both homebrew and pirate images, which pirates download and and use on emulators
or real machines.

 

^ ROM is the wrong definition for these things. "disc image" or "ISO image" is the proper term. And the devices to allow these to be loaded from mass storage aren't called "flash carts" or "flash device".

They are called "optical drive emulators" or "disc drive replacement" or something along those lines.

These things can't be "flash carts" because there is no flashing going on. Let me explain.

A flash cart gets it name due to the fact it has a type of static memory chip on it. Games are flashed onto it from the storage device (typically a SD card) to play. The whole game is right there so any part of the binary code can be read from at any given moment. CD based systems read the data in "real time" and only the parts of the game file binary code needed at the time are loaded to memory.

These devices load the game code in "real time". There is no flashing of chips going on in there.

 

The terminology might be different (I'm new to the world of backup cartridges) but the end result is the same, as far as the user is concerned.And such devices are clearly possible - if they were impossible, then software based console emulators (such as ZSNES, WinUAE, etc) wouldn't be able to load disc images from a hard drive, but they can as the emulator translates the emulated console's requests for disc data into a form suitable for directing the emulator's copying of data from the disc image into the emulated console's RAM. And an Everdrive for such a (real) console would perform the same function (albeit in very different physical form) and in effect the console would think it was reading from a physical CD when in fact it was reading from a rom image on a hard drive or SD Card.

Yes, I said that already. My point in mentioning the XBox (and in creating this thread) was to list machines that didn't need a flash cart as they can be modified to behave similarly already.

Yes. And since every game is built using the standard FAT-X filing system, you can manually go through the game's files
on the hard drive, and delete stuff that's not needed, like preview videos for other games and foreign language movie/sound
files. I've not done that for ages, but back when in the day, when I was using a smaller hard drive in the XBox, it was
well worth doing as you could save enough space to install a few extra games.

From my experience, the term 'ROM' is used across the 'net to mean ALL common forms of digital files that contain game code, be they cartridge images, cassettes images, disc (floppy, CD, or DVD) images, etc. The term 'ROM' used to mean the unalterable memory that contained the operating system, back in the 8 bit days, but when the 'net took off it seemed to become accepted to call game images 'roms' (which I don't like), just like we now call utilities 'applications', low level language usage 'high level programming', and 'optimised' means it can run on a two core CPU with 4GB of RAM...