rare footage of Zelda Twilight Princess circa 2005 - things not in the final game

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvjcnMnsUf4

the Sacred Grove seems much darker in this version. not just because of the quality of the video - i mean the atmosphere of the game. the skeleton warriors and undead dogs. part of this video was seen in the 2nd trailer for Zelda TP, the one from Game Developers Conference 2005.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hC6MXRhk3w

about midway through this video, you see Eldin Bridge ruins but there are rows of torches lit up, not seen in the final game.


Zelda Twilight Princess went through countless changes -- there are so many things seen in the offical trailers, gameplay videos, official screenshots and magazine scans that are either not seen at all in the final game, or changed significantly. too many to list.

 

and so it starts...

As with Ocarina, I guess the net will thrive with "TP 'hackers'" ><

 

I can name a few (Granted, I would need to take a look at some of the old Gamespot gameplay videos from older E3's to give a bigger idea of how much was changed).

-Link's tunic was changed. It was a less detailed green in the older videos (Someone lighter, too), and was given a overhaul by E3 2006.

-Hyrule Market was greatly changed. Earlier shots showed a less detailed version with more fog with a different (but similar), layout, and with more townspeople.

-Fog was much more common in older shots, either implying that they were not finished with some areas and art, or that the world was far bigger then the finished product and the fog was used to keep the FPS at a constant rate.

-Some art and enemies were much simpler and not as defined.

-Several enemies were showcased in earlier shot and either modifed (The Armos, which are much smaller in the main game), or taken out (The moblin-like enemies).

-The obvious change to the Twilight system, from black and white to a more sunset-like colors. (Liked the black and white better, personally. Gave it a bit more feeling of coldness)

-There were several dungeon rooms and designs showed earlier that looked like they were dropped or removed. (A fire dungeon, and a simple looking dungeon).

-The forest area seemed to be much bigger in the older versions, and had some sort of moss man that was never seen in the final game.

-The boss of the Goron Mines had a different design, and his boss room was much simpler (That, or just a test room).

-From the looks of it, the game must have been restarted at least once. Too much of the old art looks far too simple in the E3 2004 through 2005 shots for it not to have some sort of overhaul on some level. Also, its a hunch, but I dare say the plot was also restarted or re-writen several times (It seemed mingled and unpolished in the final game).

-Goron wrestling seemed to be used more in older versions. Older videos showing the concept of it, and the location of several unused sumo platforms in the goron mines make be believe that you had to wrestle for the keys instead of just talking to them (I find it hard to believe that they would spend time programming it just so you would use it twice in a training session, and only once against the gorons).

-Several coral ponds show up in older trailers and pictures, but do not appear in the final game.

-One of the Gohma bosses was dropped. In one of the older trailers, it showed a Gohma-like spider chasing link through a tunnel. Not in the final.

-The art style also seems to have been changed partway through development. Earlier shots looked like OoT's lighting (Shadow casting, being much more darker, relying on shade to produce a visual effect). Later shots show more bloom and less shading to produce a much more brighter visual style. (I can go into more depth, if anyone wishes me to explain it).

-Also, a magic system also seems to have been dropped late in development. One late development shot shows a green magic meter (The same meter used for breathing underwater and the lanturn). Unless this was some sort of placeholder, which is always a possibility (Especially if it was in a debug mode of some sort and they were finishing up the color pallet for the lanturn meter and used green as a default)

-As with the above difference, the same picture showed that the Darknut's shield was more round.

I can name other things, but I would need to look at pre-release videos. Personally, I think the non-dungeons areas might have been completely restarted around the time of the first delay, judging by the condition of the final V.S. the screenshots shown at the time (Just to give you a idea, there was a media blackout of new screenshots from around the time of August 2005, to around E3 of 2006. If you compare shots, you will see a vast difference in quality).

I also think the control was not finished for the GCN version for some time while the Wii version was in production. I remember seeing a few differences in the control in older versions that seem like they might have been intergrated into the GCN version because of the Wii controls (Basically, things you could not do until they started to make the Wii version).



EDIT: Going through some of the old videos now. Few differences:


E3 2004 Trailer stuff:
--------------------
-Shows various areas, such as a section of hyrule field with water (may appear in the final, although it was greatly modified or changed), a rainy field area (Don't remember that being in the final. Weather was not in the final. EDIT: Was weather in the final? My memory is telling me it was after Midna was dying and had to go see Zelda, but I know it doesn't appear otherwise), scene with a legion of enemies is obviously not in the final (and the sun looks different)

-Shows the dropped moblin enemy hitting you with a pole of some sort in what looks like a test room (Looks like it may have used some of the coding from the mioblins in Wind Waker. Many enemies in TP share AI to WW enemies)

-Showcased a block puzzle in a unknown temple. Blocks do not appear like that in final.

-Battling enemies in a wooded area that is much bigger then anything in the final. Also, those enemies do not appear in that area in the final.

-Hard to see shadow enemy that does not appear in the final.

-Goron Mines-like boss using a area fire attack and chains as weapons (I always beat him before he could do anything, so correct me if I am wrong). I think they scrapped the AI for the one shown in the trailer, but kept the concept.

E3 2005 Trailer stuff:
--------------------
-The twilight kargoroc is not implemented yet. Also, the normal one shown looks different then the final

-A scene with Collin crawling though a tunnel is shown. Nothing like that in the final.

-Open wood area is shown. Nothing like that in the final.

-Link has his green tunic by the time he transforms into a wolf, and he walks into the twilight realm instead of being dragged into it.

-Area where Midna and Wolf Link break through a iron cover in a jail cell and drop down. Area not in the final.

-Ghost Rats in the twilight prison area of Hyrule Castle. Not seen so early in the final.

-Lantern oil is in the trailer, but the bee larva in the shop has a different icon. Don't remember the shop lady holding the milk like that, either.

-Canoe in Link's village. Also, the layout seems a bit different. Also, link is never alone in the canoe in the final at the fishing spot.

-Wooded area with totem polls and light shining down appear, not in final (I remember seeing a trailer with them in it, though).

-Those skull child enemies appear in a wooded area similar to the trailers GigaDrive posted. Not in final.

-Stafolos are shown in a wooded area. They are much rarer in the final.

Forest Temple Videos:
--------------------
-The item icon display in the upper right had the R button as a useable button for items. Also, Z was used for hints (Although Midna was not revealed yet). Items were on the right D-Pad button instead of Up. Also, commands such as Parry with B come up.

-Lizafolos were present in the first part of the temple. They do not appear this early in the main game.

-The "Item get" sound when you get a big item is different. It sounds less choir like in the older version.

-The gale boomerang was gotten via a chest early on in one video instead of via the money mid-boss.

-Item icons recieved a overhaul. Many of them are different at this point of time.

-The layout of the center room of the temple with the big skulltula is different. There is a gale boomerang switch to the north, and the general layout is different.

 

I have a PAL demo of TP for Wii from an event. Too bad I can't explore the disk for now, without any way to dump and all

 

Whoh, whoh, whoh...How old is this disc?

 

Provided that it's a PAL disc (not NTSC) , it's 'pressed' (Not RVL-R disc) and it was from the recent Wii events around Europe, I would say it's fairly recent if not identical to the retai version.

 

Aww, I was hoping for a E3 build (Eh, it may be the same build). Can you not play it?

 

Nope, for two reasons.

1) I don't have a PAL Wii

2) I don't have a Wii at all at the moment.

The guys from the event did tell me that the disk is the E3 build, that said, but I always take things with a grain of salt.

 

The next question may be obvious: Are you willing to sell it, or do you want to hold on to it?

 

Well considering i got this and the Red Steel Press Kit, Wii Press Kit, and the rare greek-printed manual of NORTEC in excellent condition, for free, I think I'll hang on to them as they didn't affect my budget

 

Interesting...as far as I can tell, the recent TP demo that appears in the Wii kiosks at Gamestops/EB games is very similar to the demo from the most recent E3 event. My store has had one for some time, and I 've spent a little time with it.

-The game is mirrored just like the E3 version is, and is mirrored in the way the GC version ended up being. Although, I'm sad to say I can't remember weather he's right hand or not in this demo, or in the E3 demo:shrug:
I'll have to check the next time...

---Similarities to the E3 build include---

-The game starting off in a section of the Goron Mines (second dungeon)

-You are equipped with the iron boots, the gale bommerang, and the bow

-the scarecrow-like dummies that appear in Ordon Village are placed throught the first area of the demo, one on the groud for sword practicing, one up top for bow shot practicing.

-Midna gives tips throught the demo

-You are forced to shoot down a line of moblins up on a platfrom with your bow

-You eventually fight the boss, which is not shown in the E3 demo, but possible in the Gamestop demo. The boss is MUCh easier than in the final game, and goes down in about 2 reps instead of the usaul 3-4

---Differences from the E3 demo include---

-armored Lizalfoes (the ones with bone masks, not the ones with metal armor that appear later in the final game) do not appear as enemies in the Gamestop demo

-The area where you are forced to use your gale boomerang to lock onto targets to solve a puzzle seems to be different

-the barrage of enemies that appear in front of the boss room in the E3 demo are not present in the Gamestop demo, or the final game



Their may be a few more things, but I can't think of them at the moment. I'd have to play the demo again, as well as watch the demonstration of the E3 build again to know if there is anything that i'm missing.

 

if the game's mirrored, then link is definitely left handed, as in the GC ver.

Oh well, I guess I do have a near-e3 version

Too bad I don't have nor intend to buy a PAL wii.

 

Just for clarification, Link is left handed. So if it is mirrored, he would be right handed GC version is not mirrored, the Wii version is.

 

well, i was basing my post on the previous one. As with all matters of relativity, it's a an issue of your point of reference ;p

 

Sorry guys, I forgot to mention, if it wasn't obvious already, that in the Gamestop demo, sword slashing is NOT controlled by the B button like in the E3 trailer. But like I said, this is BEYOND obvious, just thought i'd clarify for those that might not have played the game, and realized that that was changed late in development.

 

I don't believe this was mentioned either.

In the E3 2004 debut trailer for TP...there is a VERY quick shot of Link fighting one of the pig-like moblins from Wind Waker. You can see the creature attack Link with his staff, as it bounces off of his shield.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZWoMc7KfTss&feature=PlayList&p=3CCF95C288862DF9&index=4

Here is the Youtube link to the trailer. It's exactly a minute in length. The quick shot can be seen at the 26 second mark.

It is especially interesting that these creatures were not in the final game. But considering TP runs off of a modified WW engine, it is very possible the moblins were used in a test room/dungeon that was used at the start of development. In which case they may have used familiar enemies/A.I. to test during the games development. Kind of similar to the 3D rendered version of the first dungeon from the original LOZ that was used during OOT's development, which also cotainted a floating Wallmaster, that didn't make it into the final game.

Just a theory..

Any thoughts?

 

I m sorry to inform that TP does not run on the same engine as WW. What Nintendo said was just to justify their sudden change of direction in the visual style without admitting defeat. Indeed, if WW was universally accepted as 'hip', TW would not retain the more mature look, but we d be looking at a completely different title.

As far as engines go though TP and WW don't run on modified version of each other , as I said before. You can trust me on that one ;p

Similar, but not same, objects might have been used though, regarding 3d models etc.


PS: at 00:27 it's obvious that it's not the same character model from WW. The concept of the character is the same, not the model.

 

Yeah, I mentioned it earlier. Personally, going through the game again, it seems like some of the enemies share some coding, that or they were designed to act very similar to their wind waker counterparts (Granted, there are only a few enemies that behave similar).

Anywho, on the engine debate: I do think it is a modified version of the WW engine. They share the file format (People have already been able to extract models in the GCN version because the model formats were the same as SMS and WW), have leftovers from WW, and just behaves far too similar to WW for it to be a completely new engine. I find it hard to believe that Nintendo would just start from scratch when they have a fully working engine they could use.

 

I was referring to the rendering engine primarily. The screen also is set at slightly different resolutions at times. (Eg: WW's opening is at pure 640x480, whereas TP isn't)

obviously most of the battle mechanics etc were in for an update, but not a substitution.

 

Oh, the rendering engine. Yeah, I can agree on that.