Bad trader (or business) You might get a kick out of this..

Discussion in 'Off Topic Discussion' started by noahstauff, Feb 20, 2015.

  1. noahstauff

    noahstauff Active Member

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    Hello fellow gamers, I want to give a part PSA bad trader post / You might find this funny post.
    I'd ordered a 103 piece security bit kit from a company called Newelectronx awhile back. Almost all of the bits were poorly made and for the most part unusable. I decided to try and get some (any) form of compensation, even just "We're sorry its out of warranty" Instead, I got this... (I reference you guys, my retro gaming community forum at one point) Enjoy.

    First Entry (Noah Stauffer created this entry on February 14, 2015 10:24:13): Dear New Electronx, I purchased the 103 piece kit as a Christmas present. I'd read the great reviews of your product on your site and decided that it was a quality product and ordered it with a clear conscience, however the product arrived in poor shape. I realize that the product is out of warranty, but several of the bits are un-usable due to manufacturing defects... bent, dis formed. I could supply you with pictures if you wish. I believe you are a reputable business, and I would like to recommend your products to my friends, but my experience has sadly been less than stellar. I hope you can resolve this, so that I may use your service again in the future. Thank you for your time, Noah

    Representative Replied from the Sales & Billing Dept. ~ February 19, 2015 14:43:33 Good Evening Noah Stauffer, Thank you for contacting us today. May I, please, have your order ID number so that I may further assist you with your concerns. Regards, Customer Service

    Noah Stauffer Comment ~ February 19, 2015 15:13:02 I placed the order some time ago. but I can look.

    Representative Replied from the Sales & Billing Dept. ~ February 19, 2015 15:28:49 Good Evening Noah Stauffer That would be most helpful. If it is not too much trouble can you please find it. Otherwise, in case you lost your latest order ID number, all hope isn't lost. Simply provide us with more information about your purchase. Acknowledgement or specifics of your order ID number cannot be freely given for security reasons, if lost or unknown. If you don't have your order ID number then we will be more than happy to provide you with your order ID number; pending you provide us with the following information that was used on the order: Full Name Billing and/or Shipping Address City, State, Postal code Phone number We have to ask for this information for security purposes to the original owner of this information. If you are not the original owner or cannot prove this by providing this information then we cannot make the order ID number privy to you - nor continue with customer support about a previous order. We look forward to receiving your response. Sincerely, The Newelectronx Customer Service Team

    Noah Stauffer Comment ~ February 19, 2015 15:29:10 I placed the order some time ago. but I can look.

    Representative Replied from the Sales & Billing Dept. ~ February 19, 2015 17:41:41 Good Evening Mr. Stauffer Wonderful, get back with us once you have looked. We look forward to hearing from you shortly. Have a wonderful evening. Regards, Customer Service

    Noah Stauffer Comment ~ February 19, 2015 17:54:28 Sorry, I accidentally refreshed the page and it resubmitted the same post. It wouldn't let me respond after that. (Contact info here) My father placed the order, and he is okay with me giving you this information, because he cannot find the order number.

    Representative Replied from the Sales & Billing Dept. ~ February 20, 2015 13:10:16 Greetings Noah Stauffer: Wonderful, thank you. What may I have the pleasure of helping you with today? Regards, Customer Service

    Noah Stauffer Comment ~ February 20, 2015 13:30:05 The product I received is of very low quality, several of the bits are deformed making the kit mostly unusable. I know you are a reputable company, and I'd like to recommend your services to friends, but my experience so far has not been great. Looking forward to hearing from you soon, Noah

    Representative Replied from the Sales & Billing Dept. ~ February 20, 2015 14:01:38 Good Day Mr. Stauffer: Thank you for taking notice. Everything that our company has received; we have earned through hard work and perseverance. Our dedicated customer base will stand by us and continue to support our product lines. Over the past 13 years in America, the Newelectronx brand has evolved into a culture. This is only possible because of the quality of Newelectronx products. Having he capability to be passed down from the original purchaser to the next allows our items to transcend generations. People who use Newelectronx share our company beliefs - a belief in unwavering quality, a belief in the value of good American service, and a belief that the equipment should be as dependable as the people who use it. I admire your willingness to mention that you want to recommend us to your friends. What friends would that be? Please explain. We have existed during the generation when aggravated review services spoiled companies reputations; and we have transcended into a reputable arena where your word doesn't hold any weight unless you have proof or bases to back it up. Which is a good place for American companies (or any company) who values the integrity of their reputation. Your order was originally created months ago. Why do you select to contact us with your issue today? Why didn't you contact us at once? Can you please address these peculiar anomalies, so that I or my colleagues may better assist you with your claim? Looking forward to hearing back from you. Warm regards, Customer Service

    Noah Stauffer Comment ~ February 20, 2015 14:07:01 Thank you, I collect vintage video games and am part of a forum community with similar interests of repairing and modifying systems that use the types of screws that your bits can open. I would have certainly brought this to your attention earlier, but I hadn't had the need for one of the bits, until I went to use it and realized that it did not fit. I then looked closely at more and saw that several were similarly dis formed. I would like to, as I said before recommend this kit to my peers as it contains several hard to find bits all in a convenient kit. Thank you for your time, Noah

    Representative Replied from the Sales & Billing Dept. ~ February 20, 2015 14:57:59 Good Day Mr. Stauffer Thank you. Fair enough and certainly understandable. Taking a look at your order, I can see that you ordered the 103 Screwdriver tool kit. Which of those 103 pieces are not suitable for use. Please identify the part locating the branded identification code inscribed on it. Also please take care to note which devices you are having trouble using the said parts on. Identify the devices by informing us the manufacture, brand, and model you are attempting to open with that said part. This is optional and certainly not necessary, but if you would like you can upload an image of the part and/or the devices. If you have more than one image then zip those pictures together. Alternately, you may wish to create a video or upload the images on another website. If so, please provide us a link and we'll take a look. We will try to make this journey of correcting your concerns as painless as possible. Please bare with us along the way. Sincerest regards, Newelectronx Customer Associate

    Noah Stauffer Comment ~ February 20, 2015 15:46:21 Attachment (click to download): I'll have to send the files one at a time as they are over the maximum upload limit. It may be difficult to see in some of the pictures but several of the skinny bits (including ones I did not take pictures of) are bent. The tri-wing bits the "wings" are not in alignment so they do not fit the screw and thus cannot remove them. I was attempting to open my Game Boy Advance, which will be pictured in the next attachment. I've tried to include the requested part numbers in the pictures taken. Thanks, Noah

    Representative Replied from the Sales & Billing Dept. ~ February 20, 2015 17:06:02 Good Evening Noah Stauffer, I'm sorry I think you still have us mistaken. I thought I was clear in letting you understand who we are. First off you contacted us with a blackmail cliche in your initial request, "I'd like to recommend your services to friends" Proven analytics divulge that most men don't recommend services or products that they purchase, and the small percentage who do - would do so within the first week. With that said, this statement wasn't true to begin with. Although we weren't dependent upon it; at Newelectronx we stand behind our products. This is why we decided to discuss this issue with you in hopes that we were speaking with a honest person. A small percentage of our market comes from the vintage video game industry; and even a smaller percent from vintage video game forums. Unfortunately most members (not all) are interested in reverse engineering to circumvent the OEM. While the other percentage are interested in DIY procedures that don't involve spending money. It is very seldom that you encounter an upright individual with integrity from your crowd. We do have a few reputable classic/vintage video game shops that can be trusted that we service and supply. In that, we are confident that one day - the vintage portion of your market will restore its value. We were interested in helping you resolve this concern, even though it is strikingly peculiar that you would contact us several months after having this product in your custody. The vintage collectors that we are familiar with, only spend money as needed. As was mentioned we have been familiar with this market for some time now. Thus, your intent to fool us with this line "but I hadn't had the need for one of the bits, until I went to use it and realized that it did not fit" was ignored and we still wanted to help you address any issues you might be having. There isn't a vintage or classic game person who would order a set of tools unless they were needed yesterday. However, it was your intent to perceive us to be foolish. There isn't any need to look beyond image WP_20150220_18_10_47_Pro. In the many years that we have been in business we have never produced any product such as this on our product lines. This type of deformity is a clear direct result of abuse and misuse. From the image you can witness the stress that the bit underwent in your care. This type of stress would damage our T8 product line and immediately alert our quality control system before the stress became too severe. You have placed that tool under some high stress, young man. While I am sure you have a following in your forum that would love to experience your fabrication of what you would like to think we might believe. That will not help you in an amicable resolution. It would be fun for forum chat and certainly create internet buzz. A trend which will most likely generate traffic back to Newelectronx. In the past we have seen this type of traffic generate higher sales. Seeing as this isn't your interest. Please tell us, what it is you want from us? It has been months since your order; and perhaps just as long since you damaged the T8 bit. So why contact us now? You obviously destroyed some items in the tool kit. Clearly and frankly let me know how we can help you with this? What is it that you would hope to have been done had you fooled us to come to the understanding that this was manufactured like this in our plant? I can understand the truth, but I cannot tolerate the lies. I am sure that I speak for any other representative who might address this ticket. Frankly, what is it that you want from us? Regards, Sales Rep.

    Noah Stauffer Comment ~ February 20, 2015 18:23:49 Yes I definitely damaged a metal bit, because you can bend the crappy pot metal used to create these bits. Take a look at picture WP_20150220_18_10_47_Pro. I really wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt, but now I realize that you are an un-reputable company, selling very poorly made products. Sadly, I think you just earned a Blacklist from whatever small market your High Quality products still had, How dare you insult me. I will be reporting your scam of a business to the Better Business Bureau so nobody will be ripped off by you again. Thank you for wasting my time, and you can have a good evening.

    I have just submitted a report (The first) to the Better Business Bureau. Well... Looks like they insulted me, and you guys. I honestly cannot believe that a business would write that to a customer, especially one in a position to give them more potential revenue. I'll attach the referenced pictures to this post. Quota is maxed out look here: https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=DB065D31B19F9386!75274&authkey=!AASwW8rPBj2FwnU&ithint=album, I would have expected this outcome from a shady overseas company *cough, cough China cough, cough* but its a U.S. based company, all this talk and hype about unemployment being so high and there are businesses doing this. Wow.. guess I've been living under a rock.

    Happy Gaming,
    Noah
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 23, 2015
  2. josiahgould

    josiahgould Spirited Member

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    Well looking at their website... I probably wouldn't buy anything from them.
     
  3. lwizardl

    lwizardl Living The Dream

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  4. noahstauff

    noahstauff Active Member

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    Yeah, Like I said I'd placed the order months ago, it changed (the site).. but you make a very valid point. You can't even see their address anymore, lol.
    Thanks Wizard, It just left me with a very bad taste in my mouth, all I wanted was a simple RMA, they could have just said no.. Anyways, I wanted to make sure nobody is ripped off or otherwise abused by this sham of a company in the future.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2015
  5. arnoldlayne

    arnoldlayne Resolute Member

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    I'm just wondering if the guy who replied was really stoned or something... it sounds like he's having a laugh more than anything.

    I also have to be honest, reading through it in order, the rep does have a point - you usually buy something and at least look at it/test it out a bit once you've bought it, and you waited quite a few months before saying anything. If the metal is cheap (I'm guessing it probably is) you'd still have to 'use' it to bend it out of shape in the first place (which contradicts your "I got it like this" approach)

    I don't know... I see where you're both coming from. Still, there are some great lines in there :)

    "First off you contacted us with a blackmail cliche in your initial request, "I'd like to recommend your services to friends" Proven analytics divulge that most men don't recommend services or products that they purchase, and the small percentage who do - would do so within the first week."

    "It is very seldom that you encounter an upright individual with integrity from your crowd."

    "There isn't a vintage or classic game person who would order a set of tools unless they were needed yesterday."


    I take it back, I think he was on acid.
     
  6. Bad_Ad84

    Bad_Ad84 The Tick

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    To be honest, as I was reading your messages to them - it certainly did sound like you were threatening them.

    Id suggest not leading with "I would like to recommend your products, but until you fix this I wont - I will leave back feedback which will affect you"

    Above is paraphrased, but is exactly how I read it too. Soon as I read that part, I knew it wasnt going to end well for you.
     
  7. la-li-lu-le-lo

    la-li-lu-le-lo ラリルレロ

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    It didn't sound like a threat at all to me - I think it's a perfectly reasonable thing to say. If they had resolved his issue, then that would've been a good reason to recommend them to others, right? In any case, it doesn't justify the rude and unprofessional response they gave. That's an excellent way to alienate your customers, and if I'd experienced that, I would never want to deal with that company again. It sounds to me like they know their products are shit, and they have no way of dealing with it other than insulting people.
     
  8. forestCreature

    forestCreature Newly Registered

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    in cases like this you ask to speak directly with a supervisor or manager. did you ask to speak with any of those members of management?
     
  9. noahstauff

    noahstauff Active Member

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    True, but I think I have the right to "threaten" this kind of a company with "gasp" negative reviews.. for something that they sold me. I'm still laughing over the fact that he says "We stand behind our products" as he calls me a liar. Honestly I bet this is just some guy in his parents basement scamming people for kicks. Anyone who treats a customer (revenue) with this amount of respect, does not deserve any more IMHO. Sorry if it came across as more of a rant, but honestly.. it made my blood boil. Yes, I "Bent" a piece of pot metal by "misusing it" sigh.. Maybe I could try beating it with a sledge hammer back into shape, but I bet it would snap first. Clearly an issue with it being cast.

    I was just looking for a replacement for a sham product. In the time he took to write that nastygram he could have just sent me one, its what $10? Instead we have this.
     
  10. abveost

    abveost Robust Member

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    First page Google results for "Newelectronx" include a 1.1/10 rating on a review site and a forum post titled "Wow, Newelectronx are a bunch of scammers"
    Only address given is a PO box

    That alone should have been be a dead giveaway. And are you sure it's a US based company? They aren't registered as a business in California and English is obviously not that guys first language.
     
  11. noahstauff

    noahstauff Active Member

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    The thought had crossed my mind, but if you look at the support case notice every time I was replied to he used a different signature. They do not have a phone number, and honestly as far as I'm concerned its not worth any more of my time. I reviewed them, and I'm only out $20. They obviously have never heard of the phrase "The customer is always right" and it will probably end up costing them. If someone had the gall to say those things to my face. For asking for a refund.. and even going through the trouble of providing pictures.

    *Sigh* sorry, I don't want this to turn into a rant thread. Just know that they should not be dealt with and are clearly a group of (or a single) con artist(s).

     
  12. noahstauff

    noahstauff Active Member

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    Abveost, I wrote a review to the BBB and they showed up registered with them. Guess we'll see what comes of it.
     
  13. Borman

    Borman Digital Games Curator

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    BBB is a scam by the way, they have no real authority. Right ahead of them is yelp, also a scam site.
     
  14. Bad_Ad84

    Bad_Ad84 The Tick

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    No, this is exactly wrong. You dont threaten with a negative review - you arent supposed to use a review as leverage.

    You deal with the company, if they deal with it well - good review. If they deal with it badly - bad review. Implying you are going to give them a negative review if they dont sort it out - is a threat and is completely poor form imo.

    The customer ISN'T always right and a lot of people agree these days - http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alexander-kjerulf/top-5-reasons-customer-service_b_5145636.html

    I cant tell you how many times people have said the chips I sell do not work - when 100% of them have been bad installs. However, the fact you have this view does answer why you think threatening with a negative review is acceptable behavior.

    I agree, his response was very poor and he shouldnt have gone off on a rant. However, I can see why they would be on the defense. I imagine this would have gone a lot better for you if you hadnt have threatened them, which was my point about not leading with it.
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2015
  15. abveost

    abveost Robust Member

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    By registered I meant registered with the state/county as a business. I'm sure they're registered on a number of websites. They have a record on BBB because they've had complaints filed against them.
     
  16. Mechagouki

    Mechagouki Site Supporter 2013,2014,2015

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    Newelectronx dude's right though, we are a bunch of cheap-ass reprobates.

    That conversation clearly (to me anyway) involves at least 3 customer service reps, I would guess at a centre in India from the English used. Those people earn less in a day than the price of the tools you're complaining about, they probably struggle to empathise.

    I always buy cheap stuff like this off eBay - zero risk. My experience has been very good in general, and honestly, if it's just a few bucks I will sometimes just let an issue go - my time is worth more to me.
     
  17. MBMM

    MBMM Powered by Pied Piper

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    I think blame lies on both sides. They acted a bit unprofessionally and should have pointed to their policies to handle your request. As simple as, "You don't have a order number/receipt? It's past our return/exchange policy timeframe? Sorry, but there's nothing more we can do for you. Our policy specifically stipulates that..."

    The constant repetition of, "I'd like to recommend you to others/leave a positive review..." does indeed sound like a threat that becomes more apparent the more its restated. It makes you look kind of like a bully. Although I do think they're more in blame than you are.
     
  18. noahstauff

    noahstauff Active Member

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    I'm sorry you have to deal with customers like that Bad_Ad84. I like to think I am an honest person, and since I was delivered an unusable product I have the right to be upset. How they handle it is secondary, the fact that they sold me something that was not the quality advertised gives me the right, as a customer to be upset with the service. It's their responsibility to make sure their products are quality before selling them to customer, like I'm sure you do checking for damage, etc. This is not a step that this company takes before selling its products to people, and In my opinion justifies a negative review. However I gave them the benefit of the doubt that it was a mistake, a chance to take responsibility as the product was damaged beyond use from the factory. I don't think it is comparable to someone installing a delicate electronic component improperly. We are talking about bits of metal. He accused me of somehow damaging bits of metal.. a type of metal probably a cheap alloy that would never bend due to its makeup but would probably snap in two first. Yes, it was my mistake for not checking all the bits to begin with, but I seriously doubt that it would have led to a different resolution.

    I deal with sellers on Ebay all the time, and its very acceptable to "threaten" which really isn't a word to describe a review, a simple statement of your experience. I feel I am justified to say to others how the experience went, am I not? I do not see it as threatening in anyway, I would tell a friend a restaurant had given me bad service so that they would simply be informed and can make their own decision on whether or not to eat there, simple information sharing. I don't think that it "Threatens" anyone.

    As I'd said, I didn't expect it to go down any better than it had, as the product was certainly out of warranty I just figured I'd ask as they claim to stand behind their products. I would have been happy with a simply "Sorry its out of warranty" Instead they strung me along for days making the process as difficult as possible for me, requiring pictures. I was happy to take them, but the Rep obviously already knew how he wanted to resolve the issue, by Insulting a paying customer like a child.

    I realize Bad_Ad84 that some people will give a company, or seller a hard time because they messed up. But, If I ordered something from you and I messed up the install I would not blame you. I may inquire on some trouble shooting tips to see if I'd completely messed it up, but I wouldn't take it out on a seller if it was my fault. I like to think I treat others with as much respect as I can, as often as I can and hope to be treated the same in return. I want to say I do realize where you are coming from, but I just don't agree with how this was handled. The amount of disrespect is unreal from a company whose supposed goal is to earn money from people.

    In all honesty (I'm probably going to regret this) I'm 16 guys.. almost 17. I realize I probably could have handled that different, although it probably would have ended with the same result of not getting a replacement. I'm still learning here, a bit naive that people don't respect one another... I mean simple Economics says that if you treat your customers correctly (The customer is always right) even if you are wrong, that it will lead to positive reviews for your company eventually leading to more profit. Simple ethics. If you go into a store looking to buy something, wait for 20 minutes and none of the employees even acknowledge that you are there and you have to find the product yourself think of how you'd rate the experience. Then Imagine a different store, looking for the same product, right away an employee greets you and asks if they can help. Imagine how you'd feel after that experience compared to the former. Then Imagine the first store again, you're trying to return the product because it happens to be defective, this time the employees who ignored you before call you a liar and claim you broke it, yelling in your face an refusing to take it back. Think of how you'd feel after that experience, and how likely you'd be to recommend that store to anyone else.

    I'm still learning guys, and always try to remain objective. This is a great community and I'm glad to be a part of it, and to learn from you.

    Thanks,
    Noah

    In a sense, I ordered the kit for Christmas the year before last or more like my father did as a Christmas gift. My main interest in the kit was the Nintendo security bits, which are used to open the game cartridges of NES and Gameboy games. I didn't look at the kit of bits very closely, or have a need to use them right away. I finally, over the last weeks decided that I wanted to modify my Game Boy Advance. I went to open the system with the kit, only to realize that the tri-wing bit of the size I needed did not line up. The bit did not make a perfect triangle, one of the "wings" was offset and its hard to see in the pictures. After that I started to notice how badly made the rest of the bits were. The kit had been under my bed untouched until recently. I looked up the company's warranty policy, and found that it was way past the dead line. However the company gave a very convincing pitch of how they had strived to build their reputation for 13 years, and "Stand behind their products". I decided, what do I have to lose? The worst they can say is "sorry its out of warranty" but instead we have the aforementioned support ticket. Honestly, I would have taken that answer and accepted it. Instead, I left not only unsatisfied, but very upset. I personally thought I handled it with as much respect as I could, even after being badly insulted. The only edited information is my contact information, which I removed for obvious reasons. I wish you the best of luck.

    Wow, very Immature. You baited me, and obviously have given out my email address to various spam sites. Spam email is currently flooding my inbox. Who do you think you are? I'm getting another spam email literally every second as I'm typing this. Why don't you get a life and stop trying to ruin others.
    (This guy is obviously associated with Newelectronx)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 23, 2015
  19. ASSEMbler

    ASSEMbler Administrator Staff Member

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    spammer, and removed.
     
  20. retro

    retro Resigned from mod duty 15 March 2018

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    Aww crap, you beat me to it! Well, I'll leave this advice from my post:

    To the OP - you get what you pay for. Stop buying cheap crap - go to a reputable tool merchant and buy known brands. Buy proper, or buy again and again.

    http://www.resellerratings.com/store/NewElectronX
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2015
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