Nintendo SNES PlayStation finally uncovered! [READ THE FIRST POST BEFORE POSTING!]

Just go to YouTube and sign up to his channel. Then you'll be able to watch many other cool videos too.

 

They're gonna let BenHeck take a look-see at the prototype? I hope he knows what he's doing, but he has had experience in electronics and console modding, so there wouldn't be too much of a surprise if he actually managed to take it apart without breaking it.

 

Omy.... I wanna see that. He can do it, and hope he takes highress pictures

 

First part is up where he does tear down and over view. Really interesting how he dissects it all, how it works and what each chip actually does.

 

Owww...

Many people (myself included) offered to have a more knowledgeable look at the Superdisc, and I for one would certainly have at least worn an ESD wrist strap.

I knew before watching the vid that Ben Heck wouldn't bother taking all the proper precautions.
Let alone the lack of ESD stuff, but he's actually TOUCHING all the chips.

It's not my / our unit of course, but jeez.

Yes - Ben Heck knows a fair bit up to a point, and I'm not a qualified expert either, but I would have at least made some provision for being more careful with that thing.

Plus, we already worked out a lot of this stuff purely from the original photos - I bet none of us even get a mention.

 

Welcome to the internet, please enjoy your stay.

 

In a high-budget setup like TBHS, they probably have the type you wear around your heel, so they can move freely about the workshop. They connect through matting on the floor so you aren't tethered.

http://www.esdproduct.com/esd_heel_grounders.php

 

@Punch - lol. That's true. I shouldn't expect too much, I guess. hehe

@RetroSwim - Yeah, I thought about that after, and I used to have to wear said heel straps when I worked in cleanrooms etc. (or be tied to the bench. lol)

So, I kind of left a "limitation" comment on the vid, 'cos if he was doing anything right at all, he'd at least be standing on a proper ESD mat with a heel strap, or be using an ankle strap.

I still hate that he feels the need to constantly keep touching the chips though - There's no need at all to do that purely to point stuff out, especially on such a rare machine. (even with ESD precautions, it's simply not ideal, nor necessary.)

The good thing is, the video has already given us some clearer images of parts of the boards...

http://imgur.com/a/kwmrF

My previous pinout guesses for the CD controller ASIC / MCU were pretty much spot-on as well (regarding the main data bus, and some of the other control signals at least)...

http://pastebin.com/U0Vk6BWy

Since the system has apparently died completely now, it's FAR more likely that it's simply down to bad electrolytic caps (that ol' chestnut.)

It makes sense as well, as the audio output has apparently never worked since Dan found the system, so it sounds as though some of the caps had already started failing.

I'm wondering if those filter beads on the board are fusible types as well? It looks like it?

Anyway, let's see what Mr Hot Snot has in store for it on the next vid.
I really hope he does some proper analysis, and doesn't just poke around and give up.

Also, they really should be re-testing things like the voltage regs now that the system has stopped working, just in case one of them is shorted (which could cause even more damage next time it's powered up.)

If Ben Heck doesn't check the obvious stuff first, and then actually do some reverse-engineering, I'll probably end up punching through my monitor. lol

OzOnE.

 

uh, the owner of the prototype posted a thread earlier in the day and pretty much hinted the device got fixed. so...... yeah

 

It's quite sad really - the posters on Assembler have already done a much better job analyzing that machine based on a few blurry photos than he did with it in his hands.

But then this is a guy that thinks that putting multiple memory systems on their own buses causes "bus contention"...

 

I'm confused why it seems to be completely forgotten that they also originally found a CD in the disc drive. He said on the show they have no software for it. Is the CD just a figment of my imagination now? Why does it never get acknowledged anymore? I'm hoping if they got the CD drive working again that they tested it. Going by the disregard for it in the video, it sounds like if they get it working again that they won't even mention that CDs very existence.

I just don't get it.

Aside from that, I don't get the hate form everyone who thinks they knew all the schematics etc. of this before Ben got his hands on it. The show is for him to tell everyone about everything in there, not to just start off the show and say "If you want to know details, just go to Assembler and reference a whole mess of posts!" He was perfectly capable of figuring it out all on his own, no need to give credit to anyone else. You can't own the rights to figuring out something first.

 

@Bramsworth - Yep, I definitely recall a "CD" being mentioned too. No idea whether one actually existed, or if Dan was simply talking about a bunch of generic music CDs that were in the same box?

I never claimed credit rights on figuring some stuff out, but the main frustration comes from the fact that most of us on here really do care about what happens to this rare piece of gaming folklore, and we've offered plenty of help and hints for getting it going again (or at least to diagnose it).

I don't even expect that Dan or anyone involved with the system would necessarily have had time (nor cared) to read all the posts pn here nor on any other forum.

But, my main gripe with Ben Heck is that he so often comes across as somebody who can't identify components in common retro machines that most other people who'd ever worked with them as long as he has (over a decade now) would know right away (like the APU and DSP in the SNES).

And yet, he suddenly seems to be quoted in the way that Dan did, like "If Ben Heck can't fix it, then nobody can."

Well, that's the thing - Ben is certainly a smart guy, but he's nowhere near the same level as a "proper" engineer like Dave Jones, so it's just surprising to me that Ben would be the first choice for attempting a repair on such a rare machine.

Don't get me wrong - he clearly knows his stuff up to a point (and I've never claimed to be a qualified expert in any way), but I thought Dan was REALLY intent on finding an engineer who would be the most qualified to do all of the careful proper testing etc?

I think a fair few people on here (and certainly on Faceplant earlier) can see where I'm coming from with this - if we can figure out quite a bit purely from some fairly grainy photos, then I'm just hoping that Ben Heck will be able to do the same in the next part of the vid.

Googling for some part numbers and reading commonly-available datasheets doesn't exactly constitute reversing the schematics btw.

He was referencing the existing SNES schematics in the vid, because a large chunk of the SuperDisc is obviously based on it.

Again though, we'll have to await the second part of the vid before he gets into the more techy details.

OzOnE.

 

Oh, and part of the frustration is in the way a lot of Ben's vids are edited these days.

Sometimes they can be great and highly detailed, but quite often the most interesting stuff gets skipped over and more adverts are shoved in there?

An example of this is that the only three close-up shots of the CD drive's PCB (the first time I'd seen it) were all shown within three seconds of eachother.

But, please don't take all that I say too much to heart - a lot of the mild Ben Heck teasing is in jest.

OK, so maybe I am a tad jealous of his corporate sponsorship, lots of money, and nice workshop. There, I said it.

So yeah, I don't "hate" Ben Heckendorm, I just find some of his methods rather frustrating to watch.

(like when he stripped down that perfectly good 48K ZX Spectrum to turn it into a portable. It's fair game for newer machines, but there were only about 5 million Speccies ever made, compared to over 84 million Xbox 360s.)

 

I have to agree, he's basically just a modder that hit big time. I cringed when I watched the video, but seeing as everyone was saying great video in the other thread - I decided to keep my mouth shut.

 

I'm glad it's not just me. lol

Literally everyone who replied to my Faceplant post feels the same way.

Again, he's done some great projects over the years, but he certainly doesn't fit the "electronics engineer" label like a lot of people seem to attribute to him.

(and again, that's not me trying to say I'm an engineer either, 'cos I'm not.)

He was just a very surprising choice after the many months of wrangling by Dan to get help to repair the console, as I just assumed they were looking for the most qualified people available?

It wouldn't surprise me at all if he repairs it though, and from all the hints, it sounds like he did get it going, which is great news.

Does that make me somehow "wrong" if he does repair it - nope - I stand by what I've said.

But, I would put money on it being one or more missing power rails that has caused the problem, and even more likely a bad or shorted electrolytic cap, as I can't see him replacing any of the "custom" chips, as I very much doubt Dan would have wanted to go that far.

At the end of the day, even though it's a truly awesome find, the bulk of the system is still a SNES, so the only real custom parts in the whole system are the two chips for the CD controller ASIC and the LCD MCU.

Place your bets... now. hehe

 

The "cringing" thing is just one of those things that's tough to explain to anyone who hasn't been doing in-depth electronics for many years. lol

There's just something about some of his vids that puts me on edge.

Some of his vids are great though - especially the one on how to drive LVDS LCD panels.

 

Would have been better in someone else's hands.

 

Well, I don't know anything about engineering so i can't comment on him being at the level that deserves a show, but it seems like he's got the job done and made an entertaining vid, so I can't really relate with where the hate comes from

About the CD, I see you say you have no idea if it even existed and think that it was only mentioned. But that's not the case. It wasn't only mentioned, there were pictures of it! I'm just confused why it seems to have disappeared and not get any mention. Hopefully someone knows more about it. I'm gonna have to find a picture just to prove I'm not imagining things The whole ordeal just confuses me.

 

Yes, I do vaguely recall seeing a picture of a CD, but so much has happened since then that I've forgotten half of it. hehe

I think we were even begging Dan to get a backup made of the disk ASAP, so hopefully he did.

It's very likely that the disk still uses the standard ISO9660 layout tbh (especially from what LuigiBlood and Zoinkity have mentioned on IRC before).

There wasn't too much call for copy protection back when the console would have been released, because CD burners were still VERY expensive, and almost all of the early one would have had a CD caddy, and been SCSI based, so not too many people had them.

It wouldn't surprise me at all if Nintendo and / or Sony did add at least some form of copy protection though. I'll have to ask the guys about it again soon.

You're definitely not imagining things though, Bramsworth - I do seem to remember the CD being sat on the worktop in Dan's original vid?

 

btw, it's not that Ben Heck doesn't deserve a show either - he does do a great job of it most of the time, and does make the episodes entertaining.

It's just the label that people attach to him which gives others the impression that he's an uber-engineer who can fix literally anything. lol

Would have been great to see Dave Jones have a look at it tbh, but on the other hand, he can be quite disparaging about retro machines anyway.

I guess he just doesn't hold as much "value" to the old stuff like many of us might. You can't slag off the poor Amiga though - it's the law. lol

(see his vids on the Amiga 500, Acorn Archimedes A3000, and N64 - he often calls them "crusty" or "useles". lol)

Gotta love Dave though - I admire his honesty at least, and he really DOES know his stuff (down to the equations and all sorts of esoteric stuff, like battery tech etc.)