The Political thread ... rant away.

Sad but true...
Ukrainians shot down a civilian aircfraft MH17 from Malaysian Airlines above Ukraine.
They blame on this disaster Putin (they said he personally jump over aircraft, just like gamers did in Battlefield 3/4, and taken it down using balalaika).
Meanwhile Spanish traffic supervisor said fucking otherwise:
https://twitter.com/spainbuca
He said that just before aricraft gone from radars near him were some jetfighters. Right after MH17 fell down the sky, Kievs military called to them and said about this aircraft was shot down. How they did know it so fast?
Also ukraininans claims that Donbass militia stolen and usen missile complex "Buk" against civilian aircraft. But they forgot one very interesting thing about this complex - it allows to recognize what target you want to hit and which country this target belongs to. So even if militia really get some "Buk", they will probably seen that targeted aircraft is not Ukrainian and this is not a military aircraft.
Those who'd love math, can make some calculations and understand, that this aircraft wasn't hit by Donbass militia - in this case MH17 will fall down on Russian terrytory, not on Ukraine...
Meanwhile - trace twitter posts from spain supervisor - he says that ukrainian military captured they're tower.

 

Sad, ok. True, nobody knows with all the disinformation from both sides.

 

That's damn right mate. But problem is that ukraininan military shit bricks when they knew, that flight recorder was already taken from crash site and sent by militia to Moscow. And don't forget about spanish flight supervisor i've mention above - he is a third side of this conflict, who now suffer from action of ukrainian military.
Some more Pros and Contras:
Russia will have only troubles in case of taking down ANY kind of aircraft above Ukraine. Ukraine don't stop to claim that almost every jetfighter or aircraft were shot down by russians.
Militia will also suffer in case of taking down any kind of civilian aircraft. Reason is simple - Kiev administration try to use every possible chance to drag NATO forces to Ukraine just to help kill down every ukrainian and russian on Donbass and Luhansk republic territories.
That's why Putin doesn't support militia on Donbass and Luhansk, except some warm words. We will not send them not russian army, not any kind of weaponry due to same reason. Meanwhile ukrainian army still shelling russian terrytory near Rostov-on-Don.
Even american experts tells that there is no match between russian and ukrainian armies -if Putin will gave out an order to stabilize situation on Ukraine to russian army, everything wiil be over in a matter of days. Maximum - a month, including cleanup of hiding fascict cowards from Nazi Guard forces and Praviy Sector.
Try not to seek an arch-enemy in russians. As i've said before - we are suffered more than just enough from all war conflicts, we're were taken into. Last war was "over" only a 5 years ago. I've talking now about Second Chechen War. We don't need another one.

 

Yeah it can be the deliberate provocation - Ukrainian government fails to suppress rebellion so they need to find a reason for help from foreign countries, also it can be just another example of "excellent" ukrainian air defence work, like it was in 2001 with that Tu-154.

Ukrainian army have long-range SAMs, and other side have only short-range MANPADS that can't simply reach that altitude. For that Buk - nobody knows if it even exists and ukrainian army have a lot of them.

But some shitheads already trying to blame Russia. It's nothing new though, if you believe in all that bullshit there's already more russian troops in Ukraine than Russian army actually have lol.

 

Meanwhile in Ukraine...
Attorney general of Ukraine, Vitaliy Yarema, claims that so called "terrorists" (militia) didn't captured ukrainian "Buk" complexes. What mean is - Donbass militia is completely innocent in taking down MH17. They just doesn't have armament efficient enough to hit aircraft on 33000 feet height. So only two possible suspects are left - russian army and ukrainian army. And simple math talk against ukrainians - if aircraft were to be hit from russian side, it should fall down on russian terrytory.
It also explain hysterics of ukrainians politicians - most of flight recorders were taken to Moscow and evidence can't be destroyed anymore.
More to say - some peoples expected such events (press View Translation):
https://twitter.com/vesti_kpss/statuses/478926313831792640
Date of this tweet - a month earlier.

 

Main question is not who shot that plane down (but of course you're right in one thing - militia don't have any long-range SAMs ), but who directed it into the battlezone, and was it just an another example of human stupidity or deliberate act.

P.S. I'll pay a thousand to see faces of those idiot ukrainian and US officials if it was just an engine failure or something and plane wasn't shot down at all or it was ukrainian army's stupidity like it was in 2001. They were way too quick to blame the other side, before it was possible to make any conclusions. But even in that case there's still there's nothing funny about that situation - it's almost 300 innocent people died and nothing will bring them back...

 

Seems like there was over 100 sida experts en route to a convention in Melbourne in that plane... So adding to the human lives, research on the biggest pandemic disease we know will take a big hit... Really a tragic incident. I hope it's only an accident. Else, faith in humanity goes down a lot.

 

From what is going on in UN - nobody interested in the truth... They all talk as if they already know who shot that plane down and don't care about those people at all.

Faith in humanity? Just look at politicians and leaders and compare just their faces - 19th and first half of 20th vs late 20th and early XXI centuries. Most of current politicians look like stupid uneducated monkeys.
And those people decide fates of the countries and millions of people. Culture is degrading too.

 

Oh yeah, countless proofs that your fucking terrorists shoot the plane. A lot of photos taken by local citizens of SA-11 Gadfly owned by the terrorists.
Black boxes are in Ukrainian territory. Russia will not evade this one, it's too BIG. Russia shouldn't supply weapons to terrorists, it's like to give grenade to monkey.
Meanwhile terrorists in Luhansk are killing citizens to make a picture for so-called "Russian journalists".
It was a terrible mistake, they thought they shot Ukrainian military plane and they started to post news about that right after crash. And then they found out it was passenger plane.

Proofs:

Screenshot of posted message by lead terrorist about destroyed "Ukrainian military plane":


Crash smoke:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=4-hLTSxZhc8

Some times earlier terrorists advertise that they have SA-11 Gadfly:


Local looters (there have been reports that local citizens and terrorists took jewelry / money / electronics from dead bodies):



Chain of events:


Screenshot of terrorists tweet that now they have SA-11 Gadfly (now deleted):


And this one is intercepted talk between terrorists:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbyZYgSXdyw

I am not posting here screenshots of bodies and other drama for obvious reasons.

To @Flash and @Ashen: guys, I do not read your comments, do not bother writing them, you will go to hell anyway, as your damned country. You're either heavily brainwashed or you're paid trolls hired to defend interests of your government.
My post is for sane people who will be able to analyze the situation and do conclusions themselves.

 

And this one is intercepted talk between terrorists: were made on usual personal computer, using any audio editing tool and there's absolutely no proves that this audio interception ever happens. But one proof that this "interception" is a 100% fake - all our special forces and top rank officers knew that using open channel is strictly prohibited - they will be probably intercepted and used against them^_^
As i've said earlier - attorney general of Ukraine said that militia doesn't captured ANY "Buk" complex.
And one more thing:

That's damage not from surface-air type of missile (Buk^_^). But air-air one, which widely used by ukrainian army and installed on ukrainian jetfighters.
superg - no one cares about your bullshit due to simple reason - ukrainians through all of their short history were greatest liars and traitors. Part of your people were under Austrian slavery, another one - under Poland... Nothing changed since then. Even you betrayed your own country, leaving it behind your back and running away from it as far as ever possible with hope never return back, so what kind of "truth" you can tell, cheeky bastard? ^_^

 

superg is nothing but idiot and twerp. Pentagon officials said that they don't have any evidence of rebels having long-range (especially working ones) SAMs or that Russia supplied any. And Russia didn't. Because will be stupid and counter-productive to supply obsolete crap instead of giving new and efficient armaments or just invading the country.

Once again - it's the NATO experts said that Russian army can take Ukraine in less than one week. But it didn't happen. No matter how Kiev and NATO officials dreamed about. Russia will invade Ukraine tomorrow! No? It will be the next week! Didn't happen again! Next month for sure! Fail...

Posting anothers stupid SBU fake video with disabled comments - it's getting old, really They should learn how to use video editors and learn how real radio chatter sounds. And another GRU colonel that doesn't even exist? Come on... it's laaaame... As well as the second picture that doesn't look like 777 part at all.


Brainwashed, haha, I love how some ukrainians say to anyone who says anything different to their opinion. We don't spit nationalist crap sitting in Miami and don't want to destroy any country.
If you love Ukraine's current government so much - why you are there and not in ukrainian army?

For our country - it lived though three major wars aready.

And if it will go down - it will be in the blaze of nuclear glory along with people like you. Did you find the shelter yet? Start digging now. Or better, save the pill for proper occasion like Hitler did. Because there will be nowhere to live. Astronauts will outlive the population of Earth by a few months until they will run out of suppiles, but that's about it.
That's why it's called MAD - mutually-assured destruction.
In highly unlikely case of smaller scale nuclear war there will be a few polluted former global superpowers with ruined economy, and new ones. Like Botswana in the best case scenario. Worst case will be a few island states surviving with continents polluted and total population of a few millions. You won't be included in the list.

Noone except a bunch of banksters, some old warmonger farts and people like superg want to risk full scale global war, even non-nuclear one - current conventional weapons can level a city as easy as nukes - MRLs, especially with thermobaric warheads can be compared to that Hiroshima nuke in terms of destruction, except for additional radiation effects.

And any major war will destroy global economy. It's very different from the first half of 20th century now. Even that sanctions-schmanctions game can get the people who started it double "Economic Crisis" cocktail, if they will try hard enough and russian government will decide to spank EU and US companies a little. FYI business elite from all sides is unhappy with this sanction game already.

Also ukrainian and some western (not all of course) media keep calling eastern rebels "terrorists". "Terrorists" didn't commit any terror act yet. Guerillas, rebels, insurgents, separatists, whatever will be the proper term for those people. Terrorists are people who murdered civilians in Odessa massacre. Because if you mine the road to destroy army tanks - it's called "guerilla warfare", not terrorism. Both sides are combatants.

Shelling buses with refugees and russian customs and villages look much more like terrorism to me. And it's not some media bullshit, old friend of me was barely able to escape to Russia, she didn't care about all this stuff until her 15 years old younger brother was killed in by a piece of glass during "anti-terrorist" attack. And when they attempted to flee their bus was attacked by ukrainian army close to Russian border, they fled on foot and thank God that nobody was killed. If it's Russia is the aggressor, why thousands of people flee to Russia, not to Kiev?
A lot of my friends from Ukraine left the country, from all parts, and as in all civil wars there was a situation where one of my friends joined the militia, other was in Ukrainian army, he's in Slovakia now and says "Fuck it! We believed that we fight against corrupted government but in the end we got another one which is nothing but more corrupt oligarchs and a fucking civil war, if we were to stop some idiot rebellion (it was before the national guard and "terrorist" trend) and help civilians to live normal life again, then why one happy 80 years-old granny tried to thank me with a hammer..."



For the plane - whoever shot that plane down must be punished. Along with that ATC who directed that plane into battle zone and ordered to go at lower altitude.
For now there's no proof on anything but a few facts. Plane crashed, it was directed into a battle zone, all people onboard died. Anything else said in the internet, in the media or by politicians from all sides are nothing but speculations and propaganda.

 

Ashen, this damage can be either from AAM or just from hitting something, but clearly there's nothing like long-range SAM can do on any part which are on the pictures available on the net. I saw it personally what georgian Buk did to plane.

Btw, Ashen, don't fall as low as superg and don't call all ukrainians liars and traitors.

After all my great grandfather lost a leg in Kursk battle, his friend was injured even more - one hand and both legs, and he was from Kiev. Even in western parts there's not even a half of population want to fap on Bandera portrait and many don't like what's happening there either.
Some of my friends were in Kiev and western parts of Ukraine supported that maidan, but then realised that they were used like a condom.

Also thing is - the worst weapon ever created isn't the nukes or even biological weapons but mass media. Before TVs people had to buy a press and they had to choose and analyse. TV just feeding the BS. And internet is even worse sometimes - not even there's a lot of trolls, but many news media taking BS fakes from blogs and show it as a real news.

Soviet Union lost the propaganda war just because soviet propaganda was mostly the exagerrated and censored truth. While western propaganda often turned things inside out. And what is happening in most ukrainian media can make Orwell's 1984 look like utopian tale.

P.S. Sometimes i really want that device that Snake Plissken had in the Escape From L.A.

Video games and mobile phones are cool things but sometimes i think that people can be way more happy with mechanical toys without mass media and high-tech weapons.

 

-> Hei' Hitlah !!!

 

fuckinhell! :concern:
...
not getting roped in but as an english resident, the above collection of RAGS don't help the cause, well maybe independent at a push. (and i see NO guardian)
as soon as i saw sun, mirror, express, mail, telegraph, the problem is clear to see and a reminder of the status-quo.
a post about 'mass media weaponisation/deus est machina' said it best!
...
as an english resident i DON'T trust a word any of those...tabloids spew.
...
that's not to question this subject, but any of the above state a known fact like: 'the sky is blue, grass is green and the sun is a nuclear furnace' it's discredited at source, because where it came from...
...
just my piece on what my eyes are seeing! nthego:
[edit]
discredited because of their lies in past/present, not much different to most mainstream medias really.

 

Russian government now is trying to hide all evidence.

SA-17 moves towards Ukraine from Russia:


Terrorists escorting SA-17 (Donetsk region):


Moment of rocket launch:


Photos of SA-17 in Torez:


Photos were released by Ukrainian intelligence department.
There is also information that Russian government ordered to take all SA-17's back to Russia.

Here are proofs that Russia is destroying all evidence (official Russian information agency (ИТАР-ТАСС) web-site printscreens):

left pic translation (before tragedy): "DNR rebels captured anti-aircraft facility with some SA-17's"
right pic translation (after tragedy): "DNR press-office: rebels do not possess any SA-17's in Eastern Ukraine"

Meanwhile on plane crash site

Terrorists do not allow OSCE mission to visit site:


(when mission approached terrorists they started air shooting)

Today DNR terrorists took away remains of 37 victims.
Unfortunately terrorists also took away black boxes .
A lot of passenger valuable belongings (as I've said earlier jewelry, electronics, phones, etc.) were looted by terrorists and some local citizens (and it's a shame).

 

Haha, usual fakes - pictures of something inpe the middle of nowhere at night without any distinctive landmarks or even a timestamp. Youtube and tabloids are full of this shit, you can find a lot of dead alien bodies. So what?

Rest of your words have no proof, except one thing - some bodies hit local people homes and in that cases these usually get removed quicky.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-OSCE-observers-conducting-investigation.html
Single picture from this article proved that all this bullshit is a fake - SAM launchers used in "Buk M1-2" (which are used by ukrainians) have a radar, which are able to scan up to 110-120 km (not miles!). But it's codename is 9C18M1 (NATO codename is «Tube Arm»). Even if foto's provided by superg is real, militia doesn't have any of "Tube Arm", only SAM launcher 9А310М1-2, which are unable to scan up to even 70 km... Funny, isn't it? Idiots are always act like him - grabbing some shit on road and giving it everyone around, claiming that is a chocolade^_^
One more thing (superg foto):

And that's cat piss is a trace of Buk missile? That's a how Buk missile trace looks like:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HQLh-HKaz8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdBMogexK3Q#t=114
https://twitter.com/andersostlund/statuses/490123028291133441
https://twitter.com/nahtrezer/statuses/490117413615468545

UPD: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...onspiracy-theories-doing-internet-rounds.html

 

Ashen is bright example of typical russian citizen, swearing a lot and insulting others.
This is just a reference example of how these people act.
That country should be separated from rest of world by building a thick wall.

About that photo - it was some time after rocket was launched.

 

Photo says otherwise - at the moment of launch. Trace from Buk holds up to 3-5 minutes. Theres a videos how airplane fall down and... There's no trace from Buk missile^_^ How the hell it's ever possible? There's no even a single witness, who saw this miracle trace. Air-air missiles have evanescent trail, but surface-air don't.